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01-07-2013, 10:32 AM | #11 |
Crimson Nerd
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 12,581
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Quote:
If guys think any corporation cares now (or ever did for that matter) about any "brand" or product, you're out of your minds.
It is all, and always has been and always will be about money, M-O-N-E-Y, and the all mighty dollar. :( You're just kidding yourself if you believe otherwise, it IS after all what DOES make the world go round and all anyone really cares about in the end. . Heck, it's practically the only reason G.I. Joe has any retail presence at all. The name-recognition of an established brand is valuable enough in and of itself that Hasbro will probably always at least apply some minimal effort to keeping the brand alive. The fact that G.I. Joe has produced as much product (a good bit of it good quality product at that) as it has over so many years of lacking significant media support is a testament to that. |
01-07-2013, 02:19 PM | #12 |
THE PITT - Head Janitor
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Running with the little guy, Fighting to make change
Posts: 1,412
|
I also remember when 'Revenge of Cobra' came out in August of '84. Flint, Zartan and the Dreadnoks, the new Snake eyes design, Roadblock, and others had not been introduced yet at retail. It would take until March, April, through July to get any of these figures released at retail.
Funny how Hasbro had their shit so together that the would know what figures they had in the works many years in advance. Keep in mind, it takes a couple years to get a cartoon mini-series completed and onto the air waves. The honchos in charge of G.I.Joe at the time were so wise and on the ball. Only after the show had been in syndication for months; familiarizing the viewers and Joe fans with the new characters did Hasbro release the figures. It was a great time. There is no excuse why Hasbro has so many delays now. It is quite ironic that a company that performed so well before the 'age of computers' falters so much now that there is email and whatnot to help facilitate corporate efficiency. Something the founder of McDonalds once said, "Take care of the customer and the business will take care of itself." This is something Hasbro has yet to learn for themselves. Well perhaps their slipping market share and earnings will help convince them to rethink their obstinate position on things. Perhaps then they will open up 'lines of communication' and be receptive to what adult customers desire out of the line instead of what their market researchers and child interaction specialists have 'come up with'. Everyone needs to take the time to watch the informative featurette on the DiC vol 2 DVD pack. They have their Joe design team leaders and they explain how the DiC series was representative of the 'wild' and 'crazy' (they actually used these terms in the video) colors that were indicative fashion of the late 80s. These design people actually stand by their design choices with their naive optimism. I submit to you this misplaced optimism is what drove the line into the ground and these same dunderheads are the department heads now. They explained how their market researchers and child psychologists would set kids down in the hasbro playrooms and have the kids play with whatever the designers pulled out of their magic fluorescent colored toilet. What the kids gravitated towards is what Hasbro ran with; no questions asked. That really worked out well. For awhile. Anyway I want to point out when the original 13 were produced, Hasbro didn't do this awefully sterile and analytical approach to product design. The designers were INSPIRED to come up with a military themed toyline which was based off of a few veteran Hasbro designers ideas. Play testing with kids came much later thereby corrupting the line. I think Hasbro needs to instead be setting some adult collectors down to play with their designs and give them some ideas to run with that are more adult and forthright. However, I get the idea the big honchos at Hasbro don't want to do that. Not because only making play time fantasy for kids is their stock and trade, but because the adult designers at Hasbro don't want other outside adult fans to tell them what to do. That is why I mention taking care of the customer and the business will take care of itself. Hasbro is not taking care of all of its customers. That is the Bottom line and Hasbro's bottom line suffers because of this failure to expound upon this unappreciated customer base. __________________
__________________
"To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men." -Abraham Lincoln "A little rebellion now and then is a good thing......It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government." -Thomas Jefferson “They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security” -Benjamin Franklin |
01-07-2013, 02:33 PM | #13 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
|
Marketing, pure and simple.
To sell more toys. Sunbow was popular. Kids would see the new figures early, find favorites, and as soon as in the store: "MOM BUY ME THAT!!" |
01-07-2013, 02:39 PM | #14 |
Hisstank.Com General
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 5,841
|
Quote:
I also remember when 'Revenge of Cobra' came out in August of '84. Flint, Zartan and the Dreadnoks, the new Snake eyes design, Roadblock, and others had not been introduced yet at retail. It would take until March, April, through July to get any of these figures released at retail.
Funny how Hasbro had their shit so together that the would know what figures they had in the works many years in advance. Keep in mind, it takes a couple years to get a cartoon mini-series completed and onto the air waves. |
01-07-2013, 06:07 PM | #15 |
I LIVE!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Altus, OK
Posts: 6,087
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Quote:
where are you seeing that POD aired a year in advance? or did you mean you thought the figures for 1985 came out before the cartoon?? It aired Sept 16, 1985--Sept 20, 1985.
before that there were just the two miniseries. Mass Device in Sept 1983 and Revenge of Cobra in Sept 1984. beginning of the fall season There wouldnt have been a new cartoon until Sept as that was how syndication and the networks ran things back then. They would not have debuted a new cartoon in the "off season" in the summer. There were no half seasons like today. (Walking Dead Im looking at you) Quote:
I also remember when 'Revenge of Cobra' came out in August of '84. Flint, Zartan and the Dreadnoks, the new Snake eyes design, Roadblock, and others had not been introduced yet at retail. It would take until March, April, through July to get any of these figures released at retail.
Quote:
Funny how Hasbro had their shit so together that the would know what figures they had in the works many years in advance. Keep in mind, it takes a couple years to get a cartoon mini-series completed and onto the air waves.
And it does NOT take a "couple years" for a cartoon SERIES, much less a mini series. Most animation efforts occur concurrently with the design of the toys so that both are on market at about the same time (which also tends to be the source of disparity between the product and the show, the SHARC in particular is different in Revenge of Cobra, and I suspect some of the differences with Flint, Lady Jaye and the Crimson Guard could be attributed to this). Quote:
The honchos in charge of G.I.Joe at the time were so wise and on the ball. Only after the show had been in syndication for months; familiarizing the viewers and Joe fans with the new characters did Hasbro release the figures.
Quote:
It was a great time. There is no excuse why Hasbro has so many delays now. It is quite ironic that a company that performed so well before the 'age of computers' falters so much now that there is email and whatnot to help facilitate corporate efficiency.
Quote:
What the kids gravitated towards is what Hasbro ran with; no questions asked.
That really worked out well. For awhile. Play testing with kids came much later thereby corrupting the line. Quote:
I think Hasbro needs to instead be setting some adult collectors down to play with their designs and give them some ideas to run with that are more adult and forthright.
Remember, the most collector friendly line since the end of the movie push was PoC...which saw some of the lowest retail support for the brand in over a DECADE (SIGMA SIX SAW MORE RETAIL SUPPORT THAN PoC!!) Quote:
That is the Bottom line and Hasbro's bottom line suffers because of this failure to expound upon this unappreciated customer base.
Take a look at Masters of the Universe Classics. No, not the toys or the product, but the fan responses: they aren't pushing for a growing brand, and more than a few have openly spoken about once the line completes its run and/or meets certain criteria...they would be DONE with the brand. The last couple years have seen Mattel come down to the wire to secure enough subscriptions (guaranteed sales) to justify the line's existence. Reissues are effectively dead (so if you missed someone, tough luck), little product is available outside of subs, and many of the new character concepts aren't getting much traction (aside from a select few). In a couple years, the line will probably be dead and if the movie doesn't get off the ground, MOTU will effectively end as viable toy brand. That's the future ARAH GI Joe faces if collectors get their say.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
|
01-07-2013, 06:51 PM | #16 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
|
Quote:
Take a look at Masters of the Universe Classics. No, not the toys or the product, but the fan responses: they aren't pushing for a growing brand, and more than a few have openly spoken about once the line completes its run and/or meets certain criteria...they would be DONE with the brand. The last couple years have seen Mattel come down to the wire to secure enough subscriptions (guaranteed sales) to justify the line's existence.
Reissues are effectively dead (so if you missed someone, tough luck), little product is available outside of subs, and many of the new character concepts aren't getting much traction (aside from a select few). In a couple years, the line will probably be dead and if the movie doesn't get off the ground, MOTU will effectively end as viable toy brand. That's the future ARAH GI Joe faces if collectors get their say. We're a stagnant and dying breed. Some collectors only want certain characters, others only want ARAH remakes. G.I. Joe will disappear, sooner rather then later, unless a new market is created. |
01-08-2013, 07:23 AM | #17 |
THE PITT - Head Janitor
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Running with the little guy, Fighting to make change
Posts: 1,412
|
Quote:
Such unwarranted pessimism. Joe is not dying at all. I just don't believe the "wild" and "crazy design" crap the Hasblo designers foolishly believe. It is almost like they are smoking something up there in Providence that is altering their personal view of the universe. It is actually kind of scary.
__________________
"To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men." -Abraham Lincoln "A little rebellion now and then is a good thing......It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government." -Thomas Jefferson “They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security” -Benjamin Franklin Last edited by thairestauranteur; 01-08-2013 at 07:26 AM.. |
01-08-2013, 09:25 AM | #18 |
Cobra Viper
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 247
|
Quote:
I also remember when 'Revenge of Cobra' came out in August of '84. Flint, Zartan and the Dreadnoks, the new Snake eyes design, Roadblock, and others had not been introduced yet at retail. It would take until March, April, through July to get any of these figures released at retail.
It really feels like the only characters to be featured in Revenge of Cobra so far ahead were the Dreadnoks, Flint, Lady Jaye, and Shipwreck. All the rest were 1984 releases and would have been on the shelves at the time the show aired. |
01-08-2013, 09:37 AM | #19 |
Mortal Enemy
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Site B
Posts: 32,666
|
Quote:
I also remember when 'Revenge of Cobra' came out in August of '84. Flint, Zartan and the Dreadnoks, the new Snake eyes design, Roadblock, and others had not been introduced yet at retail. It would take until March, April, through July to get any of these figures released at retail.
Funny how Hasbro had their shit so together that the would know what figures they had in the works many years in advance. Keep in mind, it takes a couple years to get a cartoon mini-series completed and onto the air waves. The honchos in charge of G.I.Joe at the time were so wise and on the ball. Only after the show had been in syndication for months; familiarizing the viewers and Joe fans with the new characters did Hasbro release the figures. It was a great time. There is no excuse why Hasbro has so many delays now. It is quite ironic that a company that performed so well before the 'age of computers' falters so much now that there is email and whatnot to help facilitate corporate efficiency. Something the founder of McDonalds once said, "Take care of the customer and the business will take care of itself." This is something Hasbro has yet to learn for themselves. Well perhaps their slipping market share and earnings will help convince them to rethink their obstinate position on things. Perhaps then they will open up 'lines of communication' and be receptive to what adult customers desire out of the line instead of what their market researchers and child interaction specialists have 'come up with'. Everyone needs to take the time to watch the informative featurette on the DiC vol 2 DVD pack. They have their Joe design team leaders and they explain how the DiC series was representative of the 'wild' and 'crazy' (they actually used these terms in the video) colors that were indicative fashion of the late 80s. These design people actually stand by their design choices with their naive optimism. I submit to you this misplaced optimism is what drove the line into the ground and these same dunderheads are the department heads now. They explained how their market researchers and child psychologists would set kids down in the hasbro playrooms and have the kids play with whatever the designers pulled out of their magic fluorescent colored toilet. What the kids gravitated towards is what Hasbro ran with; no questions asked. That really worked out well. For awhile. Anyway I want to point out when the original 13 were produced, Hasbro didn't do this awefully sterile and analytical approach to product design. The designers were INSPIRED to come up with a military themed toyline which was based off of a few veteran Hasbro designers ideas. Play testing with kids came much later thereby corrupting the line. I think Hasbro needs to instead be setting some adult collectors down to play with their designs and give them some ideas to run with that are more adult and forthright. However, I get the idea the big honchos at Hasbro don't want to do that. Not because only making play time fantasy for kids is their stock and trade, but because the adult designers at Hasbro don't want other outside adult fans to tell them what to do. That is why I mention taking care of the customer and the business will take care of itself. Hasbro is not taking care of all of its customers. That is the Bottom line and Hasbro's bottom line suffers because of this failure to expound upon this unappreciated customer base. __________________
__________________
|
01-09-2013, 04:17 PM | #20 |
I LIVE!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Altus, OK
Posts: 6,087
|
Have you looked at toy shelves recently? Or last year? Joe is barely a blip on the radar, so much so that many Walmart locations won't even carry the line without a big media push (like the movie). The NAME carries more value that the actual product line is, at the moment.
GI Joe, the brand, will never die...but OUR version most certainly is. Quote:
I just don't believe the "wild" and "crazy design" crap the Hasblo designers foolishly believe. It is almost like they are smoking something up there in Providence that is altering their personal view of the universe.
Wild and crazy have always been a part of GI Joe, you take that away, you take away most of ARAH's very personality.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
|
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