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01-11-2015, 08:48 PM | #1 |
Cobra Lab Rat
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It seems that there's been massive price increase for marvel universe and Star wars 3.75 inch figures.
Does anyone have any idea why the price increases are coming so soon and are so extreme? 1 to 2 dollars is a pretty massive price increase given that the increase to 10 dollar increase was just a few years ago. There's no way these price increases are to inflation. Given the relative pricing to other toy companies, the price increase seems extreme, what do you guys think? |
01-11-2015, 10:08 PM | #2 |
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More than likely, some production cost changes have occurred over the past few months.
Given the repeated complaints of Quality control across several lines, it's possible Hasbro has moved to better facilities...which mean those facilities likely cost more. Transformers, in particular, has seen a notable upswing in production quality (if not design quality) compared to the last year. But it's important to keep in mind that the collector stuff isn't the only thing impacted: the ever popular Titan Heroes (the 12" $10 figures) are now $13 across the board, and it's a segment I don't think Hasbro would have bumped if they didn't need to. Then again, it could be a widespread "market correction" too. The US has had artificially low toy prices for DECADES. Now that the US is a stagnant market with no appreciable competition at mass retail, prices are trending into the "standard" rates many international markets pay (basically, a continuation of a trend started in 2009).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
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Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
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01-12-2015, 07:15 AM | #3 |
Crimson Nerd
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Welcome the the world of China having a growing middle class that the factory workers want the be part of. This isn't a trend that's going away soon. If ever.
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01-12-2015, 06:34 PM | #4 |
Cobra Lab Rat
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Quote:
Then again, it could be a widespread "market correction" too. The US has had artificially low toy prices for DECADES. Now that the US is a stagnant market with no appreciable competition at mass retail, prices are trending into the "standard" rates many international markets pay (basically, a continuation of a trend started in 2009). ////// By my calculations Relative to price, hasbro has gone from Star Wars 2009: $8 2010-2011: $10 (1.25 of 2009 price) +25% increase in price 2012-2014: $10 No change 2015+: $12-14? (1.20-1.40) + 20 to +40% Increase in price? Total price increase from 2009: +50% to +75% increase in price since 2009. That's a lot if the increase is really happening. GI Joe pre-2009: Less than 8? 6? (ironically I can't find the price) 2009: $8 (An increase to price Probably around +25%) 2010-2011: $8 (No change) 2012-2014: $10 (1.25 of 2009 price) +25% increase in price 2015+: $12-14? ( 1.20-1.40) + 20 to +40% increase in price? Total Price increase from 2009: +50% to +75% increase in price since 2009 if the new price changes also effect gi joe. If we factor in 2007, its and even higher percentage. I'm going to assume Marvel universe had a similar trend, but overall there's been a price increase to Hasbro's figure prices over the past few years that are WAAAAAAAAAY above inflation and occurs regularly on a 2-3 year period each time. It also is usually around 25-30% increase each time. It's just so extreme, I can't think of any logical explanation even factoring in better quality, market corrections or even rising costs in manufacturing. If it was rising costs of manufacturing, other foreign luxury toy and entertainment goods should be affected the same and have similar price increases but they're not. Strange. It's almost as if the price increases are being dictated on a schedule. |
01-13-2015, 11:45 AM | #5 |
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Quote:
GI Joe
pre-2009: Less than 8? 6? (ironically I can't find the price) 2009: $8 (An increase to price Probably around +25%) 2010-2011: $8 (No change) 2012-2014: $10 (1.25 of 2009 price) +25% increase in price 2015+: $12-14? ( 1.20-1.40) + 20 to +40% increase in price? Total Price increase from 2009: +50% to +75% increase in price since 2009 if the new price changes also effect gi joe. If we factor in 2007, its and even higher percentage. 2007- GI Joe MSRP was 5.99, Walmart was charging 4.88 (WM was undercutting the entire Joe segment by 30% that year, even 8") 2008- MSRP climbed to 6.99 2009- 8.99 2010- MSRP 5.99, retailers charged anywhere from 7.99 to 8.99 2011- MSRP up to 7.99. Walmart priced 6.88, everyone else ran 7.99 and up. 2012- MSRP for Retaliation was originally 8.99, but EVERY retailer just bumped it up to 9.99. Since 2012, Hasbro has effectively stopped used the "MSRP" in material and now puts "Average Retail Price" since retailers can and will charge whatever they want. Quote:
I'm going to assume Marvel universe had a similar trend, but overall there's been a price increase to Hasbro's figure prices over the past few years that are WAAAAAAAAAY above inflation and occurs regularly on a 2-3 year period each time. It also is usually around 25-30% increase each time.
It's just so extreme, I can't think of any logical explanation even factoring in better quality, market corrections or even rising costs in manufacturing. If it was rising costs of manufacturing, other foreign luxury toy and entertainment goods should be affected the same and have similar price increases but they're not. Chinese wages have more than DOUBLED the past few years, Hasbro themselves have cited an average cost increase of 20% EACH YEAR. While Hasbro has attempted to outsource to Vietnam, the fact they keep coming back to Chinese sources says to me that Chinese sources offer the right balance of cost and infrastructure support Vietnam can't. But I think one of the biggest impacts is that around 2009...Stores stopped using toys as loss leaders. For DECADES, toy prices in the US were kept artificially low due to the practices of big retailers like Walmart. But around 2009, they stopped. I saw prices across the board (all segments, all manufacturers) jump at least 30% in the span of a year. With that, the action figure segment has seen significant declines, so in order to compensate for lower volume, Hasbro and retailers have to kick up prices. Even with all that, we, in the US, still pay less for our toys than anyone else on the planet.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
|
01-13-2015, 12:07 PM | #6 |
Cobra Alley Viper
Join Date: May 2012
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Quote:
The only reason I got back into GI Joes in 2007 (or there abouts) was because 25th Anni was a really nice update to the vintage figures, and because I could get them at Walmart for about $5 each. I think there was one Walmart around that even sold them for $4.88 for the first couple waves. But then it seemed like they started to go up by about $1 every year, after 2008/2009. Considering the fact that the only reason I really got back into Joes was because they were so cheap. $10 per figure was too much, and the breaking point was when Hasbro fudged up by not only charging us $10, but also taking away accessories, stands, and articulation at the start of the Retaliation line. Now, that whole conversation has taken place many times on this forum, but what it boils down to is that they were taking things away that they had always given us, all while charging us more. Granted, yes, later waves had many of these things returned, and the 50th Anni figures were nice (I guess) but frankly, it was a whirlwind of things surrounding Hasbro's ineptness that made me personally drop GI Joe. I did the same thing for Transformers. I started back into TFs in maybe 2006/2007, off of the Classics line and the line for the first movie. Deluxes were $10 for a while, which I thought was fine for that scale and size. Then they too started creeping up by about $1 per figure every 8 months~1 year. Most Deluxes are about $16~$17 now, and about 2/3 the size they used to be, with simplified transformations. I actually dropped TFs back in 2011 or 2012, and I feel like they've gotten more expensive, and even worse quality-wise since then. Look, I get that toys didn't really increase in price for a long time, but decades worth of price increases coming within just a few years made it very easy to drop certain lines. Sadly, most of these lines were from Hasbro, so I felt like they were really the worst offenders of too much of an increase in too short of a tie.
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01-13-2015, 01:11 PM | #7 |
Crimson Nerd
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When the choice is increase prices or basically stop making money/stop making those lines altogether, the answer is pretty clear from a business perspective.
Good lord folks, believe me if Hasbro and retailers could make a healthy profit (which is different from any profit at all, for the record) selling fully articulated, accessorized, and detailed figures for $5.99 a pop (or less), they would be doing so. It isn't that Hasbro and retailers don't want these things to sell. It's that the overall degree of sales (or lack thereof) has reached a point that it will start hurting their businesses if they don't charge the higher prices. That may well mean the massive implosion of the action figure segment that many have been predicting for a few years. It isn't as if the toy aisles haven't been shrinking significantly year-by-year at places like Wal-Mart and Target. It'll be a long time before traditional toys go the way of the Dodo (if ever), but action figures as we know them might be gone a lot sooner. ESPECIALLY if the Star Wars Episode VII product ends up underperforming. I've had a feeling for a while know that it might be the "last hurrah" of "our" style of action figure in the mass-retail environment. |
01-13-2015, 02:20 PM | #8 |
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They were about $7-8 by 2009, and despite Hasbro offering the first waves of PoC for 5.99, NOBODY (outside online shops) actually sold GI Joe that low.
Quote:
But then it seemed like they started to go up by about $1 every year, after 2008/2009. Considering the fact that the only reason I really got back into Joes was because they were so cheap. $10 per figure was too much, and the breaking point was when Hasbro fudged up by not only charging us $10, but also taking away accessories, stands, and articulation at the start of the Retaliation line.
Quote:
I did the same thing for Transformers. I started back into TFs in maybe 2006/2007, off of the Classics line and the line for the first movie. Deluxes were $10 for a while, which I thought was fine for that scale and size. Then they too started creeping up by about $1 per figure every 8 months~1 year. Most Deluxes are about $16~$17 now, and about 2/3 the size they used to be, with simplified transformations. I actually dropped TFs back in 2011 or 2012, and I feel like they've gotten more expensive, and even worse quality-wise since then.
In addition, there is a misconception on the size of the figure: Transformers actually GREW in size and especially complexity during 2007-2010. Since 2012, I've seen the size and complexity "scale back" to about where it was in 2005. I also think most misconstrue "simplified" with "simple". Transformers of all segments were getting absurdly complex around 2009-2010. While targeted to collectors, they still sell to kids, and a LOT of those "good old figures" aren't terribly fun. Quote:
Sadly, most of these lines were from Hasbro, so I felt like they were really the worst offenders of too much of an increase in too short of a tie.
For all the grief at Hasbro, they've at least TRIED to keep collector friendly product at retail as low as they could for as long as they could. With Mattel, prices creep too high, they just end the line, or in the case of Evergreen Batman, retool the product into a smaller line at the same price.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
|
01-14-2015, 10:20 PM | #9 |
Cobra Lab Rat
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: California
Posts: 3,011
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Quote:
Several factors are in play here:
Chinese wages have more than DOUBLED the past few years, Hasbro themselves have cited an average cost increase of 20% EACH YEAR. While Hasbro has attempted to outsource to Vietnam, the fact they keep coming back to Chinese sources says to me that Chinese sources offer the right balance of cost and infrastructure support Vietnam can't. But I think one of the biggest impacts is that around 2009...Stores stopped using toys as loss leaders. For DECADES, toy prices in the US were kept artificially low due to the practices of big retailers like Walmart. But around 2009, they stopped. I saw prices across the board (all segments, all manufacturers) jump at least 30% in the span of a year. With that, the action figure segment has seen significant declines, so in order to compensate for lower volume, Hasbro and retailers have to kick up prices. Even with all that, we, in the US, still pay less for our toys than anyone else on the planet. Thanks for the info Steevy. I was always curious about this pattern, now that I know about it, it worries me about how much the figures will cost in the future, but it's always good to know. I hope not. I'm looking forward to those figures :( |
01-14-2015, 11:01 PM | #10 |
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Just got an email from BBTS about the 1st wave of 4" Marvel figures for 2015. In the email BBTS apologizes for the jump in price and goes on to explain that Hasbro's prices have gone up. We've seen this in the Gentle Giant 12" retro figures and anyone who collects Mattel's MotU classics as well so let's not pick on Hasbro. As far as I know these new 4" Marvel figures are the first 4" guys from Hasbro this year. While BBTS does not price all of their figures consistently the average price per figure for a case of 9 is 15 bucks a pop. For a case of 12 it's 12.50. For all of you Joe and 4" Star Wars Black fans its time to start saving. Especially us troop builders.
I'm not looking to start a troll war here. Just thought with the promise a new 50th style line up in 2015 and more in the works for 2016, we could brace ourselves for the increase now and not cry so much when we see the stuff later this year. Which is fine by me. I've always advocated that Hasbro should focus on a quality figure and let the cost fall where they may, though the initial shipments of the 50th line were far from quality, though the more recent waves seemed to have improved.
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