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10-13-2022, 10:06 AM | #111 |
Iron Grenadier
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Alabama
Posts: 868
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Quote:
Im not in defense mode about Lee at all just calling it like I see it & the images you posted from the artists which are all really cool but for the most part except Miller's are really an Adam's clone. What I like about Lee's Batman is he brought it into the modern age with a very classic but modern edge to it that to me hasnt been matched since! Miller is in a league of his own
As far as an Adams clone, I'd venture to say that every one of those artists brought their own style to the character. And, again, the only big difference I see in Lee's Batman design is the lack of an oval on the chest (blasphemy!) and the shorter ears. Of course he brings his own style to the table, and it works for what he does, but so does everyone else.
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10-13-2022, 10:13 AM | #112 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,402
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Oooh, Wagner's a good one on Batman.
The issue with Lee is that most of his design work on the X-Men is iterative, and negatively so. His Cyclops costume, for instance, just adds a lot of needless fluff to Cyke's "yellow briefs, blue bodysuit" look that had basically been in place since 1970 or so (X-Factor aside). Byrne and Cockrum fairly easily outstrip Lee in terms of overall X-Men influence / design. EG, who's Lee's most prominent X-Men co-creation, Gambit? Gambit's a character that's basically a shorthand for "godawful 90s comic costumes." Meanwhile Cockrum is responsible for Colossus, Storm, Nightcrawler, Phoenix and the first tweaks to Wolverine's costume. And then you have Byrne with things like Wolverine's brown costume When Lee actually designs costumes, you either get generic stuff (ooh, a bomber jacket on Rogue - and he's also responsible for the bland Gen13 designs) or stuff that's straight-out terrible (again, those New 52 JLA designs and Hush-era Huntress, pretty much everything in WildCATS). His Batman mainly works because he *didn't* mess with it too much (Batman had already gone back to that style of utility belt in No Man's Land, for instance). I think my point is that while Lee's style is incredibly detailed, that doesn't make it more "modern", nor does it make it good design. It's just a style. Last edited by GeoffDes; 10-13-2022 at 11:24 AM.. |
10-13-2022, 10:14 AM | #113 |
Fartbutt McGillicuddy
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: EARF
Posts: 4,568
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He sucks.
It didn't get personal until he ruined dc comics with new 52 being 100% irreversible no matter how many times they said they've brought it back to before. (They haven't) |
10-13-2022, 11:47 AM | #114 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,460
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Quote:
Oooh, Wagner's a good one on Batman.
The issue with Lee is that most of his design work on the X-Men is iterative, and negatively so. His Cyclops costume, for instance, just adds a lot of needless fluff to Cyke's "yellow briefs, blue bodysuit" look that had basically been in place since 1970 or so (X-Factor aside). Byrne and Cockrum fairly easily outstrip Lee in terms of overall X-Men influence / design. EG, who's Lee's most prominent X-Men co-creation, Gambit? Gambit's a character that's basically a shorthand for "godawful 90s comic costumes." Meanwhile Cockrum is responsible for Colossus, Storm, Nightcrawler, Phoenix and the first tweaks to Wolverine's costume. And then you have Byrne with things like Wolverine's brown costume When Lee actually designs costumes, you either get generic stuff (ooh, a bomber jacket on Rogue - and he's also responsible for the bland Gen13 designs) or stuff that's straight-out terrible (again, those New 52 JLA designs and Hush-era Huntress, pretty much everything in WildCATS). His Batman mainly works because he *didn't* mess with it too much (Batman had already gone back to that style of utility belt in No Man's Land, for instance). I think my point is that while Lee's style is incredibly detailed, that doesn't make it more "modern", nor does it make it good design. It's just a style. |
10-13-2022, 01:08 PM | #115 |
Fartbutt McGillicuddy
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: EARF
Posts: 4,568
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one of my top favorite artists, that hasnt been mentioned enough is kevin maguire:
he drew batman in the famous one punch that took out guy gardner in justice league: other favorites are dick giordano jose luis garcia-lopez not surprising giordano and garcia-lopez were the honchos in charge of the dc style guides so they'll look similar - but still my favorite because they were doing comics too. |
10-14-2022, 02:52 AM | #116 |
Porkchop Sandwiches!
Join Date: Sep 2021
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 806
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Growing up, Jim Aparo was THE Batman artist for me. To this day, I still prefer his lean, athletic version of the Dark Knight to the over-muscled bodybuilder of so many modern takes. His sense of storytelling is up there with the best IMO, and his figure poses were just so expressive.
I was a little too late to comics for Neal Adams' Batman, but I did have the Joker and Man-Bat Power Records that he drew, and can vividly remember poring over the art in those for hours. He definitely deserves his status as one of the all-time great Batman artists. I was too young to have collected Marshall Rogers' Batman run when it first came out, but once I discovered his art, I was hooked. Luckily, most of his stuff has been reprinted multiple times. For a guy who only drew a handful of issues in the 70s, he certainly left his mark. I cannot say enough about Norm Breyfogle's excellent take on Batman. His art was so dynamic and emotive, and his layouts, in their own way, rivaled the creativity of some of George Perez's. I really enjoyed collecting his run in the 90s. A couple more favorite Bat-artists I haven't seen mentioned are Graham Nolan and Alan Davis. And I'll second the praise for Jose Luis Garcia-Lopez and Dick Giordano; JLGL's figure anatomy is second-to-none (his art is just gorgeous to look at) and Giordano either drew or inked so many of the seminal Batman stories. Last edited by YouNotCookin; 10-14-2022 at 03:04 AM.. |
10-15-2022, 06:16 PM | #117 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: Springfield
Posts: 1,672
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Yeah, Kevin Maguire's art was good and clean looking. Not overly detailed, but very good.
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01-17-2023, 07:23 PM | #118 |
Cobra Viper
Join Date: Sep 2021
Location: K.C. Mo.
Posts: 429
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This thread was really buried.Picked up Deathstroke,he's the only one i really wanted from this new wave.
Last edited by JazzyJeff74; 04-11-2023 at 05:32 PM.. |
01-18-2023, 04:18 PM | #119 |
Cobra Viper
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Elkin, NC
Posts: 131
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I dropped in to say I picked up Deathstroke, Wonder Woman and Nightwing at the N Wilkesboro, NC Wal-Mart. I think Nightwing was the only one they had multiples of.
Also got the Transformers The Movie G1 Starscream. |
01-31-2023, 01:16 PM | #120 |
Bill Cosplay
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Staying clear of knee-jerk nerds.
Posts: 5,913
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I came across a Wonder Woman in a store and it's such a bad effort. I try not to be all judge-y about toys, but these are adult collectibles under the guise of being toys, and for $10 they should've done a better job. They obviously wanted to do a modern WW, but copped out on the skirt-thing and created a half-assed hybrid thing. The figure reminds me more of "American Maid" than WW. Part of that is due to the face. It doesn't jive with the other figures in the line, and looks a Mad Magazine parody of an over-the-hill chain-smoking housewife WW or something out of Archie Comics. Plus, she's an Amazon. Why do they always insist on making her shorter then the men?
Oh, and why give her a cape, but no lasso? The whole thing is just lame.
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