[fogger1138]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wehrmanm

This is a fair summary, however based on that, you really only take issue with the "and runs" portion of what wmichben was saying. He took the money and there's been no explanation.

That's plenty to be upset/angry about, full stop. If we quibble about "thief or not?" we're missing the bigger picture that consumers willingly gave over money and got nothing of what was promised in return - and zero transparency on how badly it (if it did) fell apart.

That's an accurate summation. I'm pissed with how it turned out AND I don't think he "stole" from us. I think he made a genuine attempt to get the stuff made (with our money, which of course he took when we offered it to him); when it started falling apart, he didn't know how to address it and has gone silent rather than address our completely legitimate concerns. That's not how you handle problems with a project, and particularly one where other people are funding you.

I also think that the community of backers might have gotten a better response in early days if there weren't so many people screaming "scam! thief!" at the same time other people had valid concerns. At this point, though, I think we've passed the point of no return on that issue.

[wehrmanm]

Yep yep - we definitely mostly agree on all points.

Lord don't let this happen to whichever one of Codename Longbow or Operation Recall (I can't honestly recall which I backed at this point).

[firmpulse]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozymandias13

Do you have any proof or do you just have name-calling?

Proof? Yeah I got proof. It's been 6 fucking years and no one, including myself has gotten their figures. There's your proof, idiot.

[jabalong]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fogger1138

I'm just as irritated as anyone else by the loss of my money and the utter lack of explanation/communication/update. HOWEVER, a failure to communicate is in no way *proof* of ill-intent or that Solomon "took the money and ran". Basically, the angry mob has decided that because Solomon isn't updating us, that he stole all of our money. That doesn't follow.
There's a lot of people in this thread who seem to think this is a binary situation: either we get our figures, or Solomon's a crook who stole our money and meant to do so from the get-go, and there's no room for anything in between. It's entirely possible that he can't refund our money because he spent it trying to get the products made and it's all gone.

We know, though, that prototyping and tooling was paid for at the factory and that some parts were produced. We've seen these, not just posted by Solomon but by third-parties. That's evidence that money was taken by the factory, which stands in direct opposition to the idea that Solomon "ran off" with it.

• Has the project failed? Pretty safe assumption at this point.
• Has Solomon been as forthcoming or open as I think he should be about what's going on? Absolutely not. There's been a complete lack of communication on this that's unacceptable.
• Has the project failed because of poor management/failure to research the factory/failure to understand what's involved in manufacturing/too high standards/other reasons? You could make a strong argument for these things.
• Does any of the above mean that he deliberately stole from us, or that this was all a big scam? Not at all.

Hanlon's razor applies here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fogger1138

That's an accurate summation. I'm pissed with how it turned out AND I don't think he "stole" from us. I think he made a genuine attempt to get the stuff made (with our money, which of course he took when we offered it to him); when it started falling apart, he didn't know how to address it and has gone silent rather than address our completely legitimate concerns. That's not how you handle problems with a project, and particularly one where other people are funding you.

I also think that the community of backers might have gotten a better response in early days if there weren't so many people screaming "scam! thief!" at the same time other people had valid concerns. At this point, though, I think we've passed the point of no return on that issue.

You've summed it up perfectly and rationally. People ought to try separate their disappointment at the project failing, from their anger at how Solomon has handled the failure.

All the evidence does not point to him being a thief, but a failed toy designer/business owner. That's mundane and less satisfying than calling him a thief, but start-up businesses fail all the time.

Has he been a bad communicator? Probably. Has he been misleading? Probably. But he may also be misled himself or self-delusional. Part of him may still think this can be resurrected. Or he just can't bring himself to face the failure. Entrepreneurs often flee from their failures.

Anyway, none of this is satisfying to people who rightly bemoan their lost money and/or lost toys they looked forward to. But if anyone's a glutton for punishment, you can sink further into the abyss in this other HissTank thread, "So what happened to Hell Screamerz?".

[ozzie92]

Quote:

Originally Posted by firmpulse

*sigh*

Yet another line of idiocy from someone that confuses outright lies with the actual "risks of running a DIY toy company". Then feigns surprise when backers are mad about buying a bill of goods from a liar and thief.

Folk got took. It's real. It happen(ed)s. Quit gaslighting, punk.

Yep.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hardcorps

totally forgot about this. I was on the edge of backing it, glad I didn't.

He had a piss poor reputation BEFORE he added to it with Hellscammerz. I knew not to touch his KS with a 10 foot pole.

[DarthBrett]

Does anybody remember there was a customizer guy from here years ago (like 2007-2009ish) for ME stuff that started his own company and ended up shutting down because he took a bunch of people's money but never delivered the product. Can't remember their name now. I don't remember the name, but it was a different dude and not Solomon Witt but same kind of thing happened.

[firmpulse]

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthbrett

does anybody remember there was a customizer guy from here years ago (like 2007-2009ish) for me stuff that started his own company and ended up shutting down because he took a bunch of people's money but never delivered the product. Can't remember their name now. I don't remember the name, but it was a different dude and not solomon witt but same kind of thing happened.

Alyosha The Crook. He took a buddy of mine for almost $500. He delivered nothing but excuses and silence.

[DarthBrett]

Quote:

Originally Posted by firmpulse

Alyosha The Crook. He took a buddy of mine for almost $500. He delivered nothing but excuses and silence.

Oh yes, he was one of them! I think I bought 1 or 2 items from him a few years before he started ghosting on everyone and closed up. I swear there was also another guy around that same time, did crazy good head and torso sculpts, but maybe went under even before Alyosha.

[THEDARKONE508]

Quote:

Originally Posted by firmpulse

Alyosha The Crook. He took a buddy of mine for almost $500. He delivered nothing but excuses and silence.

i almost said alyosha. i remember him being banned from joecustoms something vaguely about that, and it was during my hiatus from collecting/customizing so i didnt fully care.

isnt he part of chicken fried toys now? his connection to it, and it being modern sculpt stuff, is why i dont even look at shit related to it.

[ozzie92]

Quote:

Originally Posted by THEDARKONE508

i almost said alyosha. i remember him being banned from joecustoms something vaguely about that, and it was during my hiatus from collecting/customizing so i didnt fully care.

isnt he part of chicken fried toys now? his connection to it, and it being modern sculpt stuff, is why i dont even look at shit related to it.

Yep?Broken Arrow Toys to Chicken Fried.