|
Community Links |
Social Groups |
Pictures & Albums |
Members List |
Search Forums |
Advanced Search |
Go to Page... |
|
Thread Tools |
03-06-2008, 10:18 AM | #11 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New Castle, Delaware
Posts: 4,498
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper46
you can EASILY say that things like "real american hero" and snake eyes / scarlett are as well known as aspect of superman, spiderman, batman, etc. i'd put those things up against the romances in those stories, aside maybe from lois and clark.
they called it gi joe for a reason. they wanted us to go see it. us, the people who have kept it alive. And they're counting on us, the fanbase, to go see it anyway, but they NEED kids to go see it, and to buy the new toyline; how many kids know a thing about Snake-Eyes and Scarlet? How many kids have read 155 issues of a comic that never even reprinted 51-155 in TPB or hardback form? BTW, if it was as popular as you claim, that would've already happened; if Marvel thought it'd be profitable, they'd have found a way to do it. Point is, there's no guarantee the movie is going to succeed no matter what changes or what stays the same, but just presenting the story of the cartoon or the original comic is not the way they feel the need to go.
__________________
danielmford.com |
03-06-2008, 11:09 AM | #12 |
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Monrovia, CA
Posts: 12,065
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper46
they called it gi joe for a reason. they wanted us to go see it.
some approach G.I. Joe the way Hasbro does, from a Brand Management POV, that has broken it down to the basic brand elements that must be adhered to to maintain a consistent brand image, which is generally the basic concept of Joe vs Cobra, the all-american hero Duke, the ninja Commando Snake Eyes, his clan adversary Storm Shadow, a female cross-bow firing intelligence operative Scarlett, etc. etc. others approach it from every detail that was present in the comics or cartoon. the problem with that position, IMO, is that was a changing and evolving story that only complimented the concepts of the toys, which is what G.I. Joe is first and foremost, not determined them. look at Snake Eyes filecards, that is the basic concept of the character that Hasbro has adhered to in continuing the character. nowhere on any of them does it mention a romance with Scarlett, so while it may have been a part of the comic it isn't an absolute or necessary part of the character, and vice versa with her filecards and character (contrast that with his relationship with Storm Shadow, which has permeated into the filecards and coincidentally? has continued to be part of the both of the characters). extend that to the basic concepts present on the other characters filecards and there you have, IMO, what G.I. Joe is about to the owner of the property, and thus really is what G.I. Joe is about. so nothing is being changed, the concept of G.I. joe has always been same, it is just that concept is able to be told in different ways. |
gunslingercbr |
View Public Profile |
Find More Posts by gunslingercbr |
03-06-2008, 10:48 PM | #13 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orange Beach, Alabama
Posts: 298
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunslingercbr
no, they called it G.I. Joe because that is what it is about. what most of us here disagree with is what G.I. Joe is really about -- heck, most disagree with Hasbro with what it is about...look at Snake Eyes filecards, that is the basic concept of the character that Hasbro has adhered to in continuing the character. nowhere on any of them does it mention a romance with Scarlett, so while it may have been a part of the comic it isn't an absolute or necessary part of the character, and vice versa with her filecards and character (contrast that with his relationship with Storm Shadow, which has permeated into the filecards and coincidentally? has continued to be part of the both of the characters). extend that to the basic concepts present on the other characters filecards and there you have, IMO, what G.I. Joe is about to the owner of the property, and thus really is what G.I. Joe is about.
i'll totally agree with you about the way Hasbro sees it. they expect US to go see it. i think, MY OPINION, that the reason they make changes is that they don't know how popular some things are. look at the pool we had on here about the Snake Eyes / Scarlett romance...ONE of the choices was NO Romance...it got about 7 - 10 votes...out of 93. 70 were for Snake Eyes / Scarlett. i'll also disagree with you about the file cards. they have started, if i'm not mistaken, to make hints and mention of their romance...i may be wrong but i'm pretty sure i've heard others say it. AND, if i'm not mistaken, didn't Hama have a big part in the file cards? LOOK, i KNOW they have to change or modify some things... MY POINT is that they might want to include things THAT popular. that and the Real American Hero. |
Crimson Guard 51 |
View Public Profile |
Find More Posts by Crimson Guard 51 |
03-06-2008, 10:54 PM | #14 |
Lt. 13th Cavalry Viper
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: mobile, al
Posts: 116
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irid70
You can easily say it, but you'd be wrong. Franchises like Spider-Man, Superman, or Batman are much, much bigger than G.I. Joe, hands down. They've been around far longer, and many more people are going to recognize Batman or Superman or Spidey than are going to recognize Duke or Snake Eyes.
i never said that G.I. Joe was bigger than Spider-Man, Superman, or Batman... those franchises have BRAND recognition. people who don't watch the movies, shows, or read the comics know who they are. what i said was that Scarlett and SnakeEyes were as well known as Spidey and MJ. that 155 long comic has been brought back, and is STILL going. EVEN Sigma 6 is hinting at them being together. WE ALL KNOW that they need kids to come to the movie. WHAT about those 2 OR the Real American Hero would prevent kids from coming to the movie? i don't think that is why they changed it. i think they changed it because they didn't really know about it and didn't figure it was as important or popular. |
03-06-2008, 11:18 PM | #15 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New Castle, Delaware
Posts: 4,498
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper46
WHY DO PEOPLE PUT WORDS INTO OTHERS MOUTHS ON HERE?
i never said that G.I. Joe was bigger than Spider-Man, Superman, or Batman... Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper46
those franchises have BRAND recognition. people who don't watch the movies, shows, or read the comics know who they are.
what i said was that Scarlett and SnakeEyes were as well known as Spidey and MJ. Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper46
that 155 long comic has been brought back, and is STILL going. EVEN Sigma 6 is hinting at them being together.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper46
WE ALL KNOW that they need kids to come to the movie.
WHAT about those 2 OR the Real American Hero would prevent kids from coming to the movie? i don't think that is why they changed it. i think they changed it because they didn't really know about it and didn't figure it was as important or popular. As for "Real American Hero," well, that ground has been fought over for so long I'm not touching it anymore. Movies now need a global audience, and "ARAH" won't do that. Also, I happen to think including characters of other nationalities is far from the worst thing to ever happen to G.I. Joe (see Big Ben, Action Man, Glenda, Quarrel, etc etc).
__________________
danielmford.com |
03-06-2008, 11:33 PM | #16 |
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Monrovia, CA
Posts: 12,065
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
i'll totally agree with you about the way Hasbro sees it.
they expect US to go see it. i think, MY OPINION, that the reason they make changes is that they don't know how popular some things are. look at the pool we had on here about the Snake Eyes / Scarlett romance...ONE of the choices was NO Romance...it got about 7 - 10 votes...out of 93. 70 were for Snake Eyes / Scarlett. when making a movie, the best idea that makes the best movie is the best way to go, and IMO, and apparently the filmmakers and Hasbro, alot of the details in the comic simply didn't translate to a great story that would be entertaining except to an audience that would be entertained by seeing the comic brought to life word for word regardless of whether it made for good exposition and storytelling. |
gunslingercbr |
View Public Profile |
Find More Posts by gunslingercbr |
03-06-2008, 11:35 PM | #17 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orange Beach, Alabama
Posts: 298
|
irid,
BEFORE the Spiderman trilogy, HOW many people outside of the comic world knew about Spidey and MJ? get a huge blockbuster out of G.I. Joe and 2 more sequels with them as a couple and they might make it to CNN...or at least MSNBC...hell, i could probably make that with a half day's work. as for Marvel 'letting it go'...they didn't own it. if i'm not mistaken, they were in bankruptcy court about the time that GI Joe was restarted. Hasbro owns it, and shopped it around. in the corporate world, sometimes bigger isn't better, and the small guy can compete better, as i'm sure you know. they are the BIG dog of DDP...the biggest seller. basically, where they were with marvel...though i am sure not at the same level of sales. currently it has broken out into 2 running series, and it had been 3 until Hasbro asked DDP to drop the series. as for A Real American Hero...i want someone to explain to me WHY that wouldn't sell. in the '80s, G.I. Joe was selling world wide... if it was pushed as a summer blockbuster, and marketted right, there is no reason it wouldn't work...and you'd get MORE of the old audience. i think i'm talking for the people who've bought the comics, watched the various corny tv shows, bought the characters and kept them in circulation for 25 years, picked the comic back up when it came back 7 years ago, etc... WE don't want to be taken advantage of. we want it to work, but there are some things that G.I. Joe ARE. nothing says there can't be other nationalities represented, they just don't have to be G.I. Joe members. |
Crimson Guard 51 |
View Public Profile |
Find More Posts by Crimson Guard 51 |
03-06-2008, 11:38 PM | #18 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orange Beach, Alabama
Posts: 298
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunslingercbr
when making a movie, the best idea that makes the best movie is the best way to go, and IMO, and apparently the filmmakers and Hasbro, alot of the details in the comic simply didn't translate to a great story that would be entertaining except to an audience that would be entertained by seeing the comic brought to life word for word regardless of whether it made for good exposition and storytelling.
Who said word for word? i even gave an example of how they could make small changes to the back story. i'll disagree with the 90% number. of course, if you know people in the industry, you may be correct. |
Crimson Guard 51 |
View Public Profile |
Find More Posts by Crimson Guard 51 |
03-06-2008, 11:48 PM | #19 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New Castle, Delaware
Posts: 4,498
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
irid,
BEFORE the Spiderman trilogy, HOW many people outside of the comic world knew about Spidey and MJ? Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
get a huge blockbuster out of G.I. Joe and 2 more sequels with them as a couple and they might make it to CNN... Were the Spider-Man films successful because they stayed strictly in comic continuity? No. They made changes. They adapted to a new medium. Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
as for Marvel 'letting it go'...they didn't own it. if i'm not mistaken, they were in bankruptcy court about the time that GI Joe was restarted. Hasbro owns it, and shopped it around. in the corporate world, sometimes bigger isn't better, and the small guy can compete better, as i'm sure you know. they are the BIG dog of DDP...the biggest seller. basically, where they were with marvel...though i am sure not at the same level of sales.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
as for A Real American Hero...i want someone to explain to me WHY that wouldn't sell.
in the '80s, G.I. Joe was selling world wide... Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
if it was pushed as a summer blockbuster, and marketted right, there is no reason it wouldn't work...and you'd get MORE of the old audience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
i think i'm talking for the people who've bought the comics, watched the various corny tv shows, bought the characters and kept them in circulation for 25 years, picked the comic back up when it came back 7 years ago, etc...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
WE don't want to be taken advantage of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Guard 51
we want it to work, but there are some things that G.I. Joe ARE.
nothing says there can't be other nationalities represented, they just don't have to be G.I. Joe members.
__________________
danielmford.com |
03-07-2008, 12:15 AM | #20 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orange Beach, Alabama
Posts: 298
|
wow, irid...where to start?
1.) Hasbro has owned G.I. Joe the whole time...they LICENSED it to marvel, giving them permission to publish the comic. same as hasbro did with transformers. 2.) marvel can't republish anything because HASBRO owns the rights. 3.) MANY parts of the original, the actual panels have been shown in the new series. 4.) if you're not one of those loyal fans who want the core of the franchise to be preserved, then I am not, nor have i ever spoken for you. don't get so touchy. 5.) if it were the baroness, it wouldn't be her taking advantage...it would be me manipulating the situation. 6.) NEVER said it wouldn't be pushed as a blockbuster...i said that ARAH with core material, if pushed as a blockbuster, would sell internationally and make money. 7.) i know action force wasn't british...not sure about the 'Real argentinian heroes' out there. 8.) the spiderman animated show? all of them? NOPE...you forgot those Spider friends from the 80's...NO MJ...remember the real life stuff...no MJ...but, i understand what you're saying...MJ and Spiderman ARE part of Spiderman...they weren't together in the beginning...he had MANY...he was a SpideyHO...but, MJ and Spidey is huge...Snake Eyes and Scarlett are just as connected in their world and can be just as huge after this movie, or the trilogy, with the toys, the film adaptations, etc. plus the people that might pick up the comic line. AHD...how great would it be to have aspects out there that connect 2 different generations of G.I. Joe fans? not only would it be good entertainment, it'd be good for the franchise, and great business. 9.) you found me out...i'm really just mad that they didn't pick me to write the thing...i HATE change... actually, i quite like it...but change for the sake of change is BAD...don't care what Barrack says. there are things about G.I. Joe that shouldn't be changed...ARAH is one, since they are american and are based on the ideals that created the country. scarlett and snake eyes is another, due to the longevity and the fact that everything since '82 has had them together, including many toy parts, etc. it's possible to keep the major parts of the story and change other parts... DDP did a pretty good job of it with Transformers vs G.I. Joe... something along those lines would be great...it was CHANGE, but it was in line with what G.i. Joe is. |
Crimson Guard 51 |
View Public Profile |
Find More Posts by Crimson Guard 51 |
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Question about making custom boxes | Ruination04 | G.I. Joe Customs General Discussion | 5 | 07-14-2008 04:05 PM |
Making Progress... | daremo | G.I. Joe Customs General Discussion | 11 | 04-20-2008 06:02 PM |
Are they still making this Variant?... | Shogi | G.I. Joe Toys Modern & General Discussion | 23 | 12-30-2007 10:36 PM |
Making the jump | Lody | General Discussion | 16 | 11-11-2007 12:07 AM |
|
|
Recent Off Topic Threads |
DarkLordMordred... |
Last Movie You Watched? |
Hisstank Late Night thread... |
What song are you listening to? |
G.I. Joe March Madness 2024 Championship Battle Armor... |