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View Poll Results: Who's the bigger Gary Stu? | |||
Snake Eyes | 42 | 70.00% | |
Sgt. Slaughter | 15 | 25.00% | |
Super Trooper | 3 | 5.00% | |
Voters: 60. You may not vote on this poll |
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07-24-2021, 07:16 PM | #41 |
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Quote:
Someone on the team has to be the best. That doesn't make him a Mary Sue. He was still treated like one of the team and not unduly obsessed over by the other characters. He didn't constantly show up every other character and show them how to do their jobs better. The villains weren't constantly saying we need to get our hands on Snake-Eyes while ignoring the other Joes. He wasn't treated like the center of the Joe universe. When Slaughter shows up out of NOWHERE and all those things happen to him, you're dealing with a CLASSIC Mary Sue. Snake-Eyes doesn't fit the definition at all. Again, Mary Sue is NOT simply asking who the strongest or most powerful character is.
You also can't really have a Mary Sue if they're in the franchise from the beginning. The classic trope of a Mary Sue is a character who enters into a PRE-EXISTING franchise and is suddenly more important than all the pre-existing characters. Again, Sarge in season 2 of Sunbow is a QUINTESSENTIAL, TEXTBOOK Mary Sue. |
08-10-2021, 12:53 PM | #42 |
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Robert Atkins draws the Stu very well: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-vcv2wr-RsS...ed%2Bsmall.jpg
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08-10-2021, 01:03 PM | #43 |
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Quote:
Someone on the team has to be the best. The classic trope of a Mary Sue is a character who enters into a PRE-EXISTING franchise and is suddenly more important than all the pre-existing characters. Again, Sarge in season 2 of Sunbow is a QUINTESSENTIAL, TEXTBOOK Mary Sue.
SE was consistently propped up and not allowed to be "less than" what LH wanted him to be. Sunbow didn't know what to do with SE and made Sgt. Slaughter into that personification. They even made him crucial in the creation of Serpentor (a role that was beautifully and cryptically filled by Storm shadow in the comics). I preferred LH's Sarge but found the Sunbow version over the top ... like LH's SE. |
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08-10-2021, 01:06 PM | #44 |
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08-10-2021, 01:07 PM | #45 |
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08-10-2021, 02:37 PM | #46 |
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So the term being used is...far afield of its' original meaning. Of the three offered, I'd say Sgt. Slaughter, but that's only because Super Trooper never really went anywhere or did anything, and above all because Rapid Fire never appeared anywhere besides toy form to my knowledge.
Snake-Eyes did evolve into the central character in Hama's mythos, but that was less "because Larry wanted it that way" and more "hey this guy is super-popular with readers and toy buyers." A Mary Sue/Gary Stu usually isn't popular (quite the opposite) with fandom (setting aside that in its' original context "Mary Sue" only applied to fanfiction so no "official" character could ever really be a Mary Sue). What happened to Snake-Eyes is the comic book/toy version of what happened with Spock from Star Trek or even more so Data from Star Trek: The Next Generation. They were popular so writers highlighted them more, often at the expense of other characters around them, or characters that started out more prominent. But seriously, read Rapid-Fire's filecard and compare it to Super Trooper's. It's hilarious, even more so if you know the story behind it all (They're both homages to Hasbro execs, but Rapid Fire's basically "one ups" Super Trooper's in every way because he was the new boss and Super Trooper was the old boss...I don't think Hama wrote either filecard, or if he did they were heavily edited). Anyway, I might argue there aren't any REAL Mary Sues/Gary Stus in GI Joe. Mary Sues swoop in out of nowhere, become the most beloved best friend and/or lover to all the characters around them (except the one or two that the author doesn't like and wants to "look bad") and solves all of the long-standing problems practically just by existing. Not even Snake-Eyes managed that. |
08-10-2021, 02:42 PM | #47 |
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This has inspired a new thread: https://www.hisstank.com/forum/g-i-j...lix-2-0-a.html
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08-10-2021, 02:52 PM | #48 |
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Yeah, I haven't read IDW so I can't comment too much. I know Helix was portrayed as a super-badass there. All I really got was what was on her RoC filecard (which was ill-explained but did sound like it added up to "super badass").
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08-10-2021, 05:22 PM | #49 |
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I remember she seemed to replace Scarlett in terms of importance, too, in some issues.
Last edited by TheOverlordCorp; 05-12-2023 at 07:05 PM.. |
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08-10-2021, 05:44 PM | #50 |
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Snake Eyes, but he's really more of a "wish fulfillment" character. The guy you wanted to be in 7th grade. No one can see his face, he doesn't talk, he wears all black ninja or tactical gear. He's loaded with knives, pistols, grenades, submachine guns and swords. He has a pet wolf. He's Special Forces AND a ninja. And to top it off, he's an unstoppable killing machine on par with Deadpool in terms of indestructability lol.
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