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07-05-2020, 02:19 AM | #1 |
Reptilian Ninja
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jacksonville, Fl
Posts: 15,963
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This weeks installment is "Does this Country Over Do It With the Military?"
My question to you guys is does this country over do it with the military stuff? I know this is going to ring someone's bells the wrong way. I personally think we do. I think calling every single person that returns a hero is wrong. A hero is one that jumps on a grenade to save a friend, pulls a friend out of a firefight after he is hit themselves,etc. Maybe it isnt a military thing but a thing our culture has for heroes. Some of these guys are just doing a job and to be totally honest I don't feel it is really doing anything for me. We all know the wars we fight these days are wars not for the safety of us but for the safety of our oil and resources. World War 2 yes, vietnam yes, but the most recent wars I am not so sure of. If we where not at war right now our country and some of the people in it would be lost. Thoughts? Im sure some of you will have them.
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07-05-2020, 04:17 AM | #2 |
Mass Nerderer
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Slitherin' around the tank- It's cool, though, 'cause I'm being "watched"
Posts: 9,097
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“War does not determine who is right — only who is left.”
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07-05-2020, 07:07 AM | #3 |
GI Joe Graffiti General
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Mindbenders Laboratory
Posts: 6,570
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Your definition and my definition of hero’s are different.
Different type of warfare now bro. The high speed low drag mother fuckers are a dying breed. Only roughly 8% are considered boogiemen. (And they cant fill the boots with this generation’s mentality) The remaining and what the military needs now are tech driven soldiers. Watch a few interviews with 3rd group, 82nd , SEALS, or Green Berets and your will see that. These guys are the Hero’s you speak of but will never seek the recognition for it. They shouldn’t. They are warriors. You are talking about most other MOS guys. Some are known to coattail stories, all come back mentally weaker, and although maybe not the definition of a hero shadow ninja, the are the definition of Brave. This generation is weaker mentally so war is something that will forever affect that. And what’s the saddest thing about that is they serve their country , mentally get fucked up , and get strung out on prescription pills. To many of my military buddies have became bum junkies that lost all credibility. But I know what they did before their addiction . And to me, they will always be hero’s.
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07-05-2020, 01:22 PM | #4 |
Iron Grenadier
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 536
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Purely from a spending standpoint, I think we really overdo it. Outspending the ten next largest militaries seems like overkill to me -- not that we should scale it back too far, it's important for America's status as a superpower, and frankly letting China or Russia outstrip us would have bad consequences for the world in my opinion, but we could divert at least some of that back home.
And as far as just wars...all war is evil. Sometimes a neccessary evil, like WWII (though all we learned from it was how to fight a modern coalition war, not that genocide should be stopped at all costs, sadly). WWI, Vietnam? The US had no business going into those -- neither side was in the right in the former, and the Vietnamese isolated themselves soon after turning communist. This is with hindsight, of course, so I'll give the people who made the decisions then that. And of course, all sides of a war, "good" or "bad", have their heroes, however one defines the term, and their villains. I'm fine thanking the troops for making the decision to serve, whatever the case, because it's a job I'd never want to have. |
07-05-2020, 02:06 PM | #5 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Iowa
Posts: 4,254
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The idea that anyone who serves is a hero, and I just disagree.
Are these heroes?: Lee Harvey Oswald Charles Whitman William Calley Robert Benjamin Rhoades Anthony Edward Sowell Timothy McVeigh Terry Nichols Nidal Malik Hasan Micah Xavier Johnson That's just a few. Doing a job most people don't want doesn't make you a hero. It just makes you a person doing a job most people don't want to do. You might be the best person on Earth, or not so much... |
07-05-2020, 03:56 PM | #6 |
US military family
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Fort Campbell, Kentucky
Posts: 2,218
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ShadowNinja, you asked, "Does this Country Over Do It With the Military?", and then you continued with a jumbled compilation of three separate conversational topics in one paragraph.
I believe Slice’s Customs understood this, and that he was just being polite about it with his response to you. Please take no offense with my blunt answers to your question(s), because I am often less polite. Of course this country overdoes it with the military stuff… that is the whole purpose of having our military to begin with. The stronger we are, the less likely we will ever have to use that force. The weaker we are, the more likely we will be challenged or attacked. Of the 195 countries in the world, one of those countries will always be cautiously respected as the most powerful by all others. At present time, that country is the United States of America, but it won’t remain so unless we take an active role in keeping it that way. Next you go on to an unrelated subject with, "I think calling every single person that returns a hero is wrong." Well, yes, and it would be equally wrong for me to call my dog an attack helicopter. Words are a part of language, and they have meanings. We have soldiers, sailors, Marines and airmen in our military, and we have numerous occupations for each, but none of those occupations are "heroes". Parents and our teachers have really let America down when it comes to teaching the meaning of the word "hero". The origins of this word are Greek, referring to qualities bestowed by the gods which allows for outstanding feats or achievements. Yes, it’s true that our military has placed some service members in harm’s way, and on a few of those occasions these individuals have excelled in ways that neither we nor they expected. Some of these events have been witnessed and documented, with award citations written about these events. I know that we disagree when you say, "We all know the wars we fight these days are wars not for the safety of us but for the safety of our oil and resources." There is too much evidence to the contrary, much of it is already declassified, so if you ignore it, that is your choice. I know your statement to be absolutely untrue, and those with the responsibility to defend do also. And lastly, you comfortably sit in judgement of past and present war, which is also unrelated to our military. The civilian populace oversees the military in our country. Technology, budget, manpower, diplomacy, etc. are all controlled by the people via their democratically elected civilian representatives. Our military does not pick and choose wars, but instead is tasked with winning them. We expect victory of them, even if that means they will have to "over do it" to win. After they win, it is true to say that all of them were just "doing their jobs". A select few of them might do their job in such a way that they will be "heroes".
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... freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it on to our children in the bloodstream. The only way they can inherit the freedom we have known is if we fight for it, protect it, defend it and then hand it to them with the well thought lessons of how they in their lifetime must do the same... - Ronald Reagan |
07-05-2020, 04:15 PM | #7 |
Hisstank.Com General
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Brooklyn NY!
Posts: 5,239
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Just a point of view. And no judgements given towards anyone else in this thread, past or future.
When you enlist you have no idea where you are going to end up stationed. You have no idea if you will be placed in harms way. You have no idea if your squad will be shot at on the day that you’re there. I believe they are given the title Hero, not because wether or not the “bad guys” choose to shoot that them on any given day, but that these young people have volunteered to stand in front of a that harm and between harm and the rest of us. Wether or not that harm arrives is not of a soldier’s making, and does not belittle their offer of service. For those who do go above and beyond that call, there are medals. On the other hand I do beilieve that we as a country have gone down a very bad road in a post Vietnam era by maintaining an invasion force. It has eliminated the need for a draft but it raises the question, if we have an invasion force standing around not invading, are there forces that will find a reason to send these hero’s into harms way unnecessarily to maintain the illusion that we need to keep a military large enough to invade at will rather than to just defend our boarders. And sending young people, who are willing to stand in front of that harm, into war unnecessarily is to wantonly squander our most precious recourse.
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07-05-2020, 05:29 PM | #8 |
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 727
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Mankind is the most abundant and easily replaceable resource on the planet. Pretty sure our most precious resource isnt the young.
Every year thousands of fresh new faces join the American armed forces. |
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07-05-2020, 09:33 PM | #9 |
Bald Master
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Wolverine Lake, MI
Posts: 15,128
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Quote:
This weeks installment is "Does this Country Over Do It With the Military?"
My question to you guys is does this country over do it with the military stuff? I know this is going to ring someone's bells the wrong way. I personally think we do. I think calling every single person that returns a hero is wrong. A hero is one that jumps on a grenade to save a friend, pulls a friend out of a firefight after he is hit themselves,etc. Maybe it isnt a military thing but a thing our culture has for heroes. Some of these guys are just doing a job and to be totally honest I don't feel it is really doing anything for me. We all know the wars we fight these days are wars not for the safety of us but for the safety of our oil and resources. World War 2 yes, vietnam yes, but the most recent wars I am not so sure of. If we where not at war right now our country and some of the people in it would be lost. Thoughts? Im sure some of you will have them. War veterans (I served, but during peace time) are heroes. There’s always room for an * in anyone’s situation, but that’s my take. I wouldn’t necessarily call peace time soldiers “heroes“ (again, I fall into that category), but I most certainly would in comparison to sports “heroes” (THAT is over done; I prefer “sports zeros”). I’m also a parent and an elementary school teacher, and still not a “hero.”
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07-05-2020, 10:13 PM | #10 |
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Idaho
Posts: 727
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I'm with Shadowninja. First off it's in the nature of mankind to fight. I mean it's been around since the first neanderthal. Survival, good resource areas. Until now 2020. Those who sign up to serve, serve in peace time and war time. In the end war is about killing and surviving. Not really sure where the word "Hero" fits, in war time situations. War is literally about 2 things. Kill..Live. I'm not trying to be a downer or anything, but when you get to the bare bones of war. It is literally kill or be killed.
Granted certain cultures view war as a life style, and in that aspect perhaps Hero, and glory are what it's about. But in these "civilized" times, war is who has the biggest cock type attitude, between the wealthy, who have no qualms about kicking back and letting others fight for them. Everyone makes this big deal about the flag and country. The flag is a piece of cloth, the country..just a place where yer parents got horny, and you were squeezed out, bloody and screaming. I'm honestly just being pragmatic. I'm sure some will disagree. Nobody likes the truth in its simplest form. Some symbol, or pride or a story has to always explain the simplest reason why things are as they are. |
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