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07-14-2009, 12:18 AM | #111 |
Cobra Soldier
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Quote:
I hate to be "that guy," but since my least favorite fighter has now been added to the conversation, I feel the need to vent.
So, to begin: I hate Lesner. It may be unfair, but I see him as a gimmick brought in by Dana White to try to cross-promote MMA with professional wrestling fans. He want UFC to make WWE money. And what does he really bring to the table? Sure, he was a great amateur wrestler, but he doesn't win with wrestling techniques. He wins because he has a size and strength advantage, natural or unnatural. He's learning good defense, sure, but technically? He pushes people down, traps them against the fence, and pummels them. Very little skill. If Mir had had forty extra pounds of muscle, he would not lose. What mostly rubs me the wrong way about Brock, is that while guys like Crocop, Fedor, Rampage and many others with real technical skills were busting their hump practicing fighting 8 hours a day and injuring themselves over in Pride, and early UFC, Brock was playing stunt-man in the WWE and lifting weights everyday. Sure, he got hurt when he screwed up a stunt, but that's it. That's why I fear even Fedor, with his old hand injury, could be in trouble with Brock. Which is sad because Fedor has more skill in one finger than Brock has in his whole body. But I would love to be proven wrong. I tend to think we need a new weight-class in the UFC. Super-heavy weight. Which is odd, because, in the beginning, there were no weight-classes, and a 180 guy could use BJJ to submit a 240 guy. But, with the evolution of the sport, that just doesn't work anymore. Kimbo is a complete waste. He's Youtube palooka who fought street fights under the most idiotic rules, where if one fighter fell to the ground, the fight stopped until the fighter got back up. No ground work, no BJJ submissions, no wrestling, no ground and pound. And he lost at least one of those fights. In his first real MMA fight (he had a couple of fights with washed-up fighters), his opponent took the ring at the very last moment, was outweighed by 25 pounds, and still knocked him to the ground with a lucky shot and pounded him unconscious in 15 seconds. He literally put Elite XC out of business. And that was with training by Bas Ruttan. He does not deserve a shot at UFC. If you want to talk about Brock I have to say your comment about no skill is pretty much bullshit. Of course he was brought in to make money from fans of fake wrestling. But he has a ton of skill, he trains like a monster, he's a great amateur wrestler who has completely controlled Heath, Randy and Mir. If you want to hate him for working in the WWE then you are pretty much just a jealous hater. Even Crocop has done pro wrestling, so has Barnett and Sakuraba. The guy got out of College and wanted to make money, at the time there was no money in MMA. He was obviously pretty smart since he made money there, then came into MMA like he wanted to and has breezed through the top of the UFC's HW's. Sure he's used the fame he got there to make more money as a fighter but shit, wouldn't you? Sure the muscle helps but if you think that is all it takes you are a fool. He uses his wrestling to maintain control, if strength was all it took Bob Sapp would be world champ... or Butterbean.... or Zulu....or Hong Man Choi. His biggest asset is actually his speed, he moves like a middle weight. Does he go for armbars, kimuras and gogo's? No, he'd be stupid to against the level of competition he is facing. He was thrown in the deep end, unlike Fedor.... He isn't getting any Zulu's or Lindlands. Don't get me wrong, I love fedor, but he isn't a god. AA made him look very human last fight, he was beating him pretty good until he pulled that telegraphed flying knee, poor AA and his brittle chin. Machida could most likely beat him, he takes hardly any punishment and is much smarter than AA. Him and Fedor aren't much different in weight either. Barnett might even beat him but I doubt it. He says he isn't afraid of him but he buys all the hype, if he thinks he is stepping in with a god then he will beat himself. Fedor may never come to the UFC, his management is ridiculous in their demands that they get co-promotion of the event and that the UFC hire many of his Red Devil teammates. Dana doesn't like the sambo clause either but really it's that they want to use the UFC to promote their own ORG that is blocking things. Who else from Red Devil would do well in the UFC, baby fedor tested positive for roids, Alex who doesn't fight for red devil anymore would be the only good one and he has HEP and can't fight in the US anymore. Fedor is great, but he will be forgotten to time, mainly because of his lack of drive in cementing his legacy. I loved Pride but it's in the past and the best heavies not named Fedor are in the UFC, once Overeem's contract is up he will be there too. AA, Tim Sylvia and Barnett aren't there because noone really cares about them, AA got destroyed by Brett Rogers and Fedor, Tim by Ray mercer, and Barnett did his Roids and burnt his bridge. Look, whether Brock is the future or not is yet to be determined. People like him definitely are, the days of a fast HW at the low end of the class with really good skill facing a big guy with none are over. Those big guys started to learn how to fight and are taking back their weight class. You have a point about adding a super hw class but it won't happen for awhile. There isn't enough talent yet for one weight class yet alone two. Really what they need is a Super Middleweight class from 200-215 and the light heavyweight class to move from 215-230. Then the HW class could be 230-265. This makes more sense as there are a ton of MW,LHW, and low end HW that could change classes and have better matchups. |
07-14-2009, 12:53 AM | #112 |
The Last Resort
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: CA.
Posts: 2,465
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Watch The Complete UFC 100 here if u want it's on my blog just thought i would offer it for those who missed it, no download necessary just press play twice DJ Stealth
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07-14-2009, 05:24 PM | #113 |
Sigma 6 Aficionado
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Dirty Jersey
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Yes Lesnar was a pro wrestler and an NCAA champ but realistically he's been MMA training for 3 years. He uses his size and strength and limited striking skills to get over his opponents.
I will admit he has fast hands for such a novice striker. Adding to the list of MMA turned pro wrestlers: Dan Sevren and Ken Shamrock.
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07-14-2009, 06:09 PM | #114 |
Cobra Viper
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 134
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"If you want to hate him for working in the WWE then you are pretty much just a jealous hater. Even Crocop has done pro wrestling, so has Barnett and Sakuraba. The guy got out of College and wanted to make money, at the time there was no money in MMA. He was obviously pretty smart since he made money there, then came into MMA like he wanted to and has breezed through the top of the UFC's HW's. Sure he's used the fame he got there to make more money as a fighter but shit, wouldn't you?"
Yeah, that's a very good point, I never thought about it like that. "Sure the muscle helps but if you think that is all it takes you are a fool. He uses his wrestling to maintain control, if strength was all it took Bob Sapp would be world champ... or Butterbean.... or Zulu....or Hong Man Choi. His biggest asset is actually his speed, he moves like a middle weight. Does he go for armbars, kimuras and gogo's? No, he'd be stupid to against the level of competition he is facing." I wouldn't point most of those guys strength to strength against Brock. Sapp, maybe. But Brock has got to be one of the strongest, if not the strongest, MMA fighter I've ever seen. And his conditioning is amazing. He doesn't seem to ever get tired like those other guys during a match. Of course, his matches haven't been that long, but still. As for Fedor, he's got a 30-1 record. I think he will be remembered, even if he never steps into the ring with Brock. I agree, Fedor has had it easy the last couple of years, and I do wonder if the drive to succeed is still there. God knows, Brock has it. I wish Dana would bend in terms for Fedor, if only to see how he fairs against Brock. |
07-14-2009, 06:11 PM | #115 |
Cobra Viper
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 134
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One last thing, can you imagine Brock with a 30-1 record? I know I can.
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07-14-2009, 08:19 PM | #116 |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Land Of Confusion
Posts: 3,046
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Dana White says Fedor Emelianenko will fight in the UFC, Brock Lesnar fight imminent...
Quote:
Prior to this past Saturday's UFC 100 event, an underground movement took root and called for mixed-martial-arts fan who would attend the show to begin "Fedor!" chants throughout the night.
The thought, of course, was to make UFC executives well aware of the fans' desire to have Fedor Emelianenko, the world's top-ranked heavyweight and arguably the greatest MMA fighter in the division's history, fighting in the octagon. The chants were never heard, but after UFC 100, UFC President Dana White said he wants Emelianenko in the UFC, that it's eventually going to happen, and that a fight with Brock Lesnar is imminent. Lesnar, the former World Wrestling Entertainment superstar and NCAA Division I national wrestling champion, picked up his third consecutive UFC victory and first-ever title defense with a dominant second-round TKO of interim title-holder Frank Mir in UFC 100's main event. With Lesnar's current streak of wins over Heath Herring, then-champ Randy Couture and now Mir, many are looking to possible future opponents for the seemingly invincible ground-and-pound machine. Emelianenko, the former longtime PRIDE heavyweight champion, is the man many see as most likely to topple Lesnar. At 30-1, with back-to-back Affliction wins over two former UFC champions (Tim Sylvia and Andrei Arlovski) and a 26-0 record (with one no-contest) over the past nine years, many fans are clamoring for the Russian fighter to take on the top talent in the world's premier fight organization. "This Fedor thing has gone on and on and on," White said in the post-UFC 100 press conference. "Eventually, Fedor's going to be here. I want Fedor. I want him to come to the UFC and everything else. "This guy (Brock Lesnar) just won the heavyweight title, and we'll end up getting that deal done. And then we'll do Brock vs. Fedor, and it'll be a huge fight." How soon could we such the fight? "Who knows," White said. "He's obviously contractually obligated to fight (with Affliction). Once that's over, we'll figure it out." UFC officials have met with Emelianenko and his representatives multiple times. However, the meetings proved far from productive and often left each side blaming the other for the inability to get a deal done. The UFC said Emelianenko's demands were too outrageous, not necessarily from a monetary standpoint (though Emelianenko is believed to make at least $2 million per fight) but because a deal would essentially require the organization to enter the Russian market as business partners with Emelianenko's manager, Vadim Finkelchtein. Emelianenko's people say the UFC's contract demands are too restrictive without any allowances, for example, for Sambo competitions and would dictate all aspects of the fighter's career. Concessions will be need to be made, and that's often led White to predict a slim chance of a deal coming to fruition. In fact, White has often criticized the fighter, going so far as saying Emelianenko "sucks" while mocking past recent opponents such as kickboxer Hong Man Choi and Matt Lindland, who normally fights at middleweight. However, White's tune has changed, and on Saturday, he spoke rather definitely about the fighter's future in the UFC. Of course, that future could hinge on Emelianenko's upcoming Aug. 1 fight at "Affliction" Trilogy." There, Emelianenko meets another former UFC champ, Josh Barnett, who many rank among the division's top three or four. However, don't expect Barnett to get the same invitation to the UFC is he knocks off Emelianenko. Why? "No one's beating down my door to get Barnett," White said. |
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07-14-2009, 08:52 PM | #117 |
Sigma 6 Aficionado
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Dirty Jersey
Posts: 482
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Theres a little interview with Lorenzo Fertitta on Sherdog.
Quote:
"There’s an online petition called FedorChant.com, where a thousand people are going to cheer “Fedor” (Emelianenko) during the main event (at UFC 100). Is that going to put more pressure on you, and just the fact that Fedor doesn’t want to sign because of sambo, was that something that you’d ever overlook?"
Fertitta: I hope all 12,000 people yell Fedor’s name at the same time. The pressure’s not on me. The pressure’s on him. They already know. The facts are the facts. We made him the best offer out there, more money than anybody offered him –- so you can’t say it’s about the money. Then they come back and they say, “Well, it’s a one-sided contract.” Let’s break this down from a logical standpoint. We offered the exact same contract that three hundred other guys have signed, including Brock Lesnar, Chuck Liddell, Anderson Silva, GSP, all the top stars. Why is that contract not good enough for Fedor? What Fedor wants is this. He doesn’t want to be exclusive. So, it’s like saying, okay, Tom Brady: “I’m going to play for New England Patriots one Sunday, but you know what? After that game’s over, I want to be a free agent and go see where I can play for the rest of the season.” Every weekend he’s going to skip around and play for whoever he wants. How does that make sense for us as a business or for the fans? He needs to come into our fold if he wants to cement his legacy as the best fighter in the world. We can figure something out with the sambo thing… (but) at the end of the day, I think we need to have a situation where at least 90 or 120 days before he’s signed a contract to fight, he shouldn’t be out there competing in events like that because I don’t want to take the chance of him getting hurt. But all of this stuff with Fedor: we want Fedor. As soon as he gets done with this show that he’s doing, he can come –- we’ve never met Fedor. I want to sit down. I want to talk to him and that’s part of the problem. We’ve never even met the guy. But it is a shame that he has not come forward to challenge the best guys in the world and I hope he comes. We want him. "Is the sambo really a sticking point?" Fertitta: That’s a big excuse for Fedor to say he’s not coming to the UFC, and quite honestly, I don’t think it’s Fedor. I think Fedor wants to compete. The issue has been his management. They’ve completely kept him aside. I’m not sure he even knows what we offered him, to be honest with you. I think if he knew what we offered, he would have been here a long time ago. There’s been a little bit of disconnect there… we want to meet him in person. We will not sit down and negotiate until me and Dana meet him in person. And if at that time he decides to not be a part of what we’re doing, then we know. "Why did you do a one-fight deal with (Mirko) "Cro Cop" (Filipovic) and not Fedor?" Fertitta: We have a direct relationship with Cro Cop and we talk to him on the phone and the deal went down so quickly. It wasn’t a one-fight deal. The contract was a quick one-fight contract, but he gave us his word that it was going to be a four-fight deal. I just got back from Croatia last week, spent some time with Mirko, went to his house. (He’s a) super nice guy, we went to lunch, and the fact of the matter is yesterday I got a contract signed for three fights. |
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