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02-05-2018, 06:56 AM | #71 |
Cobra Soldier
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Poland
Posts: 12
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Quote:
So somebody at Hasbro figured out that this shit wasn't a good fucking idea. I hate that used DCEU as an example, because not for nothing, the WB is going out of it's way to fuck up the film adaptions of those i.p.s. With the Universal Monsters, that was actually a good idea, but a bad script and a bad movie could kill anything that sounds good on paper
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02-05-2018, 07:44 AM | #72 |
Fuggin' Hawesome!
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: "Yes, I can hear you, Clem Fandango."
Posts: 4,415
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agreed.
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02-05-2018, 12:03 PM | #73 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: U.S.
Posts: 1,748
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Quote:
I wouldn't mind it - if the figures looked really cool.
Personally, I saw this as the only way for GI Joe to progress in its current form. In order to keep costs down, re-using molds in new combinations is far better than moving to 5 PoA - which was going to be the likely alternative. I think that Hasbro could come up with thousands of new (and cool) combinations of existing parts to come up with new figures. All new sculpts with the same quality as previous products would inevitably have to be sold for a premium - and price themselves right out of the market. Even straight repaints (the RoC Snow Serpent comes immediately to mind) can make for great updates. Hasbro could have given the Club a mandate and the molding support necessary to focus on completing classic '80s ARAH figures first, which is something collectors (you know, like in "COLLECTORS Club") care most about and will pay more than the average retail price for each figure. Meanwhile, Hasbro could use their size and scalability to promote an entirely new lineup of Joes for new fans and those who have whatever classics they want and are looking for something new. They could utilize and mix-and-match from their extensive parts bins and paint capabilities to deliver in bulk for low cost. Tied in with the last two movies and creating an entire new series in Joe canon with comic support, they could have brought GIJoe to a new generation in a more meaningful way. Instead, we got a Club that majored on repaints and obscure characters but demanded premium pricing for them, and minored on completing the classic ARAH figures in Modern Era form. And Hasbro got sucked into producing 50th anniversary figures that primarily sell to collectors, a small market segment, instead of a new set of exciting and relevant characters for millennials (and which adult collectors like myself who are just in it for the nostalgia draw could happily ignore while completing our collections via the Club). As a result, we have a Modern Era line that's at risk for never completing its reproduction of the '80s series ARAH figures, and hardly any appeal to younger audiences today that are needed to keep the brand alive. Last edited by edgecrusher; 02-05-2018 at 12:07 PM.. |
02-05-2018, 05:30 PM | #74 |
I LIVE!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Altus, OK
Posts: 6,087
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Quote:
Quote:
Hasbro could have given the Club a mandate and the molding support necessary to focus on completing classic '80s ARAH figures first, which is something collectors (you know, like in "COLLECTORS Club") care most about and will pay more than the average retail price for each figure.
Quote:
They could utilize and mix-and-match from their extensive parts bins and paint capabilities to deliver in bulk for low cost.
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Tied in with the last two movies and creating an entire new series in Joe canon with comic support, they could have brought GIJoe to a new generation in a more meaningful way.
Also: comics are effectively dead in terms of broader market reach. There is ZERO incentive to use the comics for anything more than idea pools (much as what Marvel has ended up doing with its comics). Quote:
Instead, we got a Club that majored on repaints and obscure characters but demanded premium pricing for them, and minored on completing the classic ARAH figures in Modern Era form.
Quote:
As a result, we have a Modern Era line that's at risk for never completing its reproduction of the '80s series ARAH figures, and hardly any appeal to younger audiences today that are needed to keep the brand alive.
The reality is that Hasbro abandoned the younger audiences when ME was launched (dumping the well received 8" line in favor of collector centric 25th Anniversary) and the attempts to re-capture that audience (with the films) has largely flopped. And when that happened, Hasbro doubled down on collectors and both them and the club were sucking whatever they could out of a declining fanbase (production runs for ME Club offerings have been less than HALF of what was being done during the o-ring days). At this stage, Hasbro has nothing to lose with GI Joe, meaning collectors are probably not going to care for GI Joe must do to succeed in today's market.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
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02-05-2018, 06:13 PM | #75 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,460
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What's the difference, besides being able to tell the future now to know a brand will be revived when you 'shelve' it due to poor sales?
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02-05-2018, 07:46 PM | #76 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: U.S.
Posts: 1,748
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I respectfully disagree with pretty much your entire post, but the part that sticks out the most to me is this:
Quote:
Also, $50 per figure is more than enough to account for unique mold costs. especially when most already have a starting point in the original o-ring version. Extremely complex (engineering by comparison) third party Transformers figures run not much more than that and require an entire new set of designs, toolings, molds, and the like, and their distribution is far smaller than a Hasbro run, and probably not too far off from a Club run. And if you think many of the same collectors who willingly pay ~$400 for a Club or JoeCon set, or even more for an MTF kickstarter, wouldn't be willing to pay a little extra to get a truly unique mold like Golobulus done, well, sorry, but many of us would. And it's not foolish at all to expect the barely two dozen original '80s series figures that are left to be completed. It's actually a perfectly reasonable and logical thing to expect, especially since Hasbro and the Club have come that close to finishing it in spite of themselves. If the Club wasn't ending this year, it's possible they could have finished it in the next 3-4 years even with their repaint fetish. Last edited by edgecrusher; 02-05-2018 at 07:53 PM.. |
02-05-2018, 08:13 PM | #77 |
Fuggin' Hawesome!
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: "Yes, I can hear you, Clem Fandango."
Posts: 4,415
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Quote:
Quote:
you can keep posting what you want, or what you think they should do, but that doesn't mean it is fiscally realistic. Last edited by Dragasses; 02-05-2018 at 09:16 PM.. |
02-05-2018, 09:12 PM | #78 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: U.S.
Posts: 1,748
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Okay, that's a little smaller of a run than I thought. Didn't realize they'd run things so badly that the community was that small! Thought we were talking a run of 2-5k, which is more in line with the smaller 3P TFs.
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new tools run in the thousands to tens of thousands.
"You can keep posting what you what, or what you think" but someone's doing something wrong if they can't make that work. ;) Last edited by edgecrusher; 02-05-2018 at 09:17 PM.. |
02-05-2018, 09:37 PM | #79 |
I LIVE!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Altus, OK
Posts: 6,087
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Quote:
Hell, the Club even had issues selling the meager second run of October Guard figure sets a few years back, despite the fan outcry over the sell out of the first meager run. Quote:
Extremely complex (engineering by comparison) third party Transformers figures run not much more than that and require an entire new set of designs, toolings, molds, and the like, and their distribution is far smaller than a Hasbro run, and probably not too far off from a Club run.
https://tfsource.com/dx9-toys/x20-skyer/ Keep in mind those figures skip a LOT of the overhead Hasbro and the Club incur like legal costs, rights clearances, and even shipping costs. The club also has the added expense of license costs to Hasbro. 3rd Party is never an apt comparison because their lack of overhead and expenses Hasbro and FunPub have to pay. Quote:
And if you think many of the same collectors who willingly pay ~$400 for a Club or JoeCon set, or even more for an MTF kickstarter, wouldn't be willing to pay a little extra to get a truly unique mold like Golobulus done, well, sorry, but many of us would.
The fandom is small and splintered, and every "faction" has their own wants which don't always line up with others. Quote:
And it's not foolish at all to expect the barely two dozen original '80s series figures that are left to be completed. It's actually a perfectly reasonable and logical thing to expect, especially since Hasbro and the Club have come that close to finishing it in spite of themselves. If the Club wasn't ending this year, it's possible they could have finished it in the next 3-4 years even with their repaint fetish.
We got repaints because Hasbro wasn't willing to invest in a failing brand. The Club does repaints because THEY don't have the money to make a pile new tooling with declining membership numbers. These are realities we can't change.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealDubya
Any sort of panic at this stage is just pure unsubstantiated reptile brain stem fear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokePants
This is why companies are secretive -- because we all want the truth, but most of us cannot handle it.
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02-05-2018, 09:38 PM | #80 |
Fuggin' Hawesome!
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: "Yes, I can hear you, Clem Fandango."
Posts: 4,415
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not trying to rain on your parade, just trying to give you some insight.
the club does a fairly good job on the figures they produce given the part molds they have access to. It's almost everything else they do that leaves people scratching their heads, and to be honest, if g.i. Joe/transformer fans weren't so diehard they would have blundered their way out of business a long time ago. but no they can't afford to go all out on new tooling. now could hasbro?, sure. will they?, probably not. the roc and retaliation lines scared off retail and doesn't look like it's coming back anytime soon. transformers movies made a billions of dollars. the joe movie made a few million. Last edited by Dragasses; 02-05-2018 at 09:45 PM.. |
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