|12-21-2009, 05:55 AM||#1|
Join Date: Aug 2008
OK, here is some intel on manufacturing that might not sit well with some of you. Also, I will not make anything up only list facts.
I have been in Materials planning, engineering, purchasing for over 10 years now so I know a great deal regarding the tooling, manufacture, and shipping, export/import of goods. I also know someone on the inside ( A toy purchasing agent for one of the big three retailers) who I recently had a conversation with.
Here are some facts, It costs almost nothing to have goods made overseas.
I have a machine part, I send the drawing out for quote and the quote comes back, 1500.00 for tooling and 10 cents a piece for a gear made of brass ( Brass in much more expensive than plastic and heavier to ship). I buy 10,000 pcs at 10 cents plus the tooling and a little less 700 dollars for the freight. That makes my cost per piece around .42 cents. We sell this gear to the customer for 267.00USD.
You also need to realize that with each addition order the price is reduced because the tooling is already payed for.
What I am trying to say is that Hasbro does well and makes a decent profit but some of you ( like me) would stop collecting if you knew how much these retailers mark up the Joe, Transformers, and Star Wars line. I could not believe the ROC figures were 10 bucks when they came out. Also, Marvel Universe went from 5 to 10 bucks overnight, My friend said that the vehicles are the biggest markup, I mean come on the Falcon and Pit are over 100 dollars and then they go on sale for half? Remember the battle pack from Target? They were 15 bucks at the end. Night ravens go from 40 to 20!
All I am saying is that as collectors we need to show some restraint when buying up these toys at full price, if people stop paying so much these retailers will lower the prices.
Example, look how comic packs ( SW, Marvel, Joe) come with a comic ( paper is expensive!) and two figures and goes for 12 or under but a single carded figure goes for 10? That should be proof enough that there is a high mark up.
A final thought is that the 25th line was priced nice ( actually a little low) and I understand a price increase but I mean the ROC, 40 dollar vehicles and 10 dollar figures is nonsense ( By the way, for 9.99 you get a vehicle and a figure but figures are 9.99?)
By the way, rent the film " The corporation" and you will never pay full price for sneakers again!
Last edited by angrypandaink; 12-21-2009 at 06:07 AM..
|12-21-2009, 07:22 AM||#2|
Join Date: Feb 2009
You're really close to mark on this. Like I've stated before in other threads I used to run I prototyping department for a collectible toy soldier company. I would see the materials cost for everything and knew the mark up we set on the MSRP and also the mark up the retailers did.
Most companies make about a 300-400 percent profit on every unit. That's why I took a shot in the dark on a past thread that the production cost of Joes was something around 25cents a unit. For better or worse that's just how the system works. Unless we wanna do something about.
By the way great movie. I've see it a few times.
|12-21-2009, 07:30 AM||#3|
Join Date: Jul 2009
very interesting. I had an idea to most of this going on, just not as in-depth.
|12-21-2009, 08:40 AM||#4|
G.I. Joe Stratigic Comand
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: I am the thread killer...
As an economist (somebody please hire me), not only do I agree with you, I know you are correct, and have seen mathematical proofs that support your statements. They are long, boring, and filled with lots of complex mathematics, but they back up your experience, and probably many readers gut feelings in a scientific way. So, to back up your points: A) Low overseas mfg. cost. - True. Provided you choose a country such as China (for example) where wages are low, material cost are low, and the exchange rate is artificially manipulated by the government of China, to promote exports, a company, lets say Hasbro, can manufacture a toy for pennies. And as for shipping I know that they can have their products imported for near ballast class shipping rates. B) The more products you buy as a company, the less each one cost. True, That is called economy of scale, and its the inverse coralary of the law of diminishing returns. C) Yes more prudent purchasing would drive down Hasbro's prices, along w/ its profit margin, simple law of supply and demand. Most likely all of those lines would stay available, with less choice, but still available. D) Comic packs, small and medium vehicles tend to be the best overall "value" from a utilitarian evaluation. E) The Corporation was an interesting movie.
So what I'm saying is right on. 60% of my collection came from sales, clearance ilses, garage sales, and swap meets and it makes me happy. Times can get tough, be wise w/ your money.
|12-21-2009, 08:41 AM||#5|
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Normandy SR2
Bottom line is the people that have the money don't give a shit (about anything or anybody but themselves). They don't mind being ripped off. They'll pay any price to get what they want. So the toy collectors that have the money will continue collecting & the rest of us will all eventually be forced out.
|12-21-2009, 09:09 AM||#6|
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Toronto, Ontario
this is definitely food for thought.
Although many of us don't have the direct knowledge of the behind the scenes wheelings and dealings of manufacturing products I think we've all suspected that this was going on.
You mention not paying full price for sneakers and I find it funny that you say that b/c lets say I want to buy a pair of Etnies skate shoes. In Canada these can cost between 100-120 which is RIDICULOUS! I will go down to the U.S. and get them for half that.. and even then I know Im over-paying.
I think in the long run it's more that collectors (with or without a lot of money) have no choice.. and with that said not even just collectors but everyday consumers. We can all stand up and tell Hasbro that we're not gonna take it anymore (yes.. Twisted Sister reference!) but in the end will it really make a difference? Not really b/c they've got us by the balls. 90% of us won't boycott them because we see it as a fruitless effort. The 10% of us who do are basically just giving up on our hobby because of the prices. Hasbro doesnt care it they lose 10% of their market since the other 90% will still be buying even if it is with reluctance and the occasional buyers will more than make up for the lost 10%. In reality each figure should be 4.99-5.99. Maybe 6.99 for a deluxe figure. Vehicles 12.99 w/out a figure. 14.99 with 1 figure and to be generous 16.99 with 2 figures. Bigger vehicles would obviously be a bit more between 25-30 a piece. And then big ticket items maxed out at 60. Hasbro would sell more product and probably see higher profit margins and more of a demand if they actually took the time to see how their prices affect the consumer and themselves.
This is just my personal opinion. I have no background in manufacturing or economics.. just a big kid who enjoys his toys and wants his buck to go a little farther.
In the end, you'll see my name carved in stone...
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|12-21-2009, 09:20 AM||#7|
The Man of The Hour
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: In the now and then
If you like, I can look up what the corporation I work for, a major Drugstore chain, pays for each figure. I work in Shipping and Receiving, and have access to that kind of thing. I can tell you that unless they are onsale our stores charge 9.99 which is absolutely ridiculous, given that in the past 4 months I've yet to pay over 5 bucks for a RoC figure. Ya know...I wonder what we pay for a case...I can likely order them at cost. Don't know why I never thought of that before. lol
|12-21-2009, 09:33 AM||#8|
Join Date: Dec 2008
There is one problem with all of this, the average American consumer is a moron.
Myself included. I paid $40 for a Night Raven. I paid $9.99 for PP Baroness. I will pay $9 or $10 each for the POC line, i will just limit the amount of figures that i buy.
I do not have the self control to boycott my favorite toy line in the hopes that prices will go down.
Heck, i do not have the self control to wait for WM to get the figures i need, because i worry about not getting them, so i pay the $6 or $6.99 at other retailers.
Really, would you skip buying the POC line, and Resolute, and the 25th return, if it brought Joe figures down to $4 each?
If we as a community pulled this off, we would create a red hot secondary market. We would go crazy seeing all of those figures we didn't have, and would pay insane prices on Ebay to get all of the ones we originally missed.
It sucks we are getting taken for a ride, but i'm not ready to walk away...
|12-21-2009, 09:40 AM||#9|
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: 742 Evergreen Terrace
Here's the sad thing -- imagine if these toys were made in the U.S. They'd be $40 per figure!
Feedback thread: http://www.hisstank.com/forum/buy-se...lyguy-1-a.html
Jesus is my Lord and Savior!!!
|12-21-2009, 10:06 AM||#10|
Official know it all
Join Date: Oct 2007
Although i certainly agree that (pardon the borrowed although apt turn of phrase) "knowing is half the battle", when purchasing figures and accompanying accessories from the big action figure producing companies, aren't we literally caught by the short hairs? Unless we don't mind waiting an interminable amount of time for a particular line/toy to go on a drastically marked down sale, aren't we caught in their obvious marketing web purchasing line after line, keeping these toy juggernauts in the black year after long year?
I think it was certainly poor planning on Hasbro's part that they invested so heavily into the RoC line and it resoundingly tanked, necessitating a drastic price mark down, but look at the Tformers line, which continues to sell gangbusters, and is practically a license to print money!! In essence, if a company like Hasbro continues to make oodles of profit from it's other lines, even if RoC isn't doing nearly as well, how are we the purchasing public demonstrating to them through our use of the almightly dollar that they should lower their prices?
And isn't this a little bit like biting the hand that feeds you, because doesn't Hasbro (and similar toy companies) produce better quality figures in the modern era (better tooling, better paint, better articulation, better accessories, etc.)- including all manner of character and vehicle obscurity- fairly regularly and certainly seeks to please its fans in this regard? I would argue a resounding yes!! Do they always get it right? Well, obviously no, but I'd rather have them happy and producing the toys I want than unhappy due to looking at the quarterly earnings statement and seeing less zero's. And I would argue most fans, in their heart of hearts, want the very same thing.
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