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07-12-2014, 11:24 AM | #61 |
Crimson Nerd
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 12,573
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Never fails...the same folks assuming Hasbro is a bunch of complete incompetents who don't care about G.I. Joe while completely ignoring the multitude of attempts to revitalize the brand that Hasbro has attempted over the last 10 years, to varying degrees of success, but ultimately not enough in the long term.
It's the brand coupled with the waning prominence of 3 3/4" action figures as a whole. Even Star Wars and Marvel are starting to languish now. At this rate I'm not going to be at all surprised if the toys from Star Wars Episodes VII - IX become the last gasp of the 3 3/4" action figure market before it shifts entirely to "niche product" status. Where the brand is concerned, it simply doesn't seem to click with kids, for whatever reason. As others have posited, a ground-up reboot probably has more likelihood of catching on big-time than yet another retread of 80's ARAH, no matter how well-done it is. Folks also like to forget that for the most part G.I. Joe has consistently been on shelves for the better part of 30 years. That is EXTREMELY rare for a toyline. The brand as a whole has been a success, but I've reached the point where I firmly believe that it's time for Hasbro to cut the cord and move entirely into the next phase of G.I. Joe...that may be a phase that we old timers don't like anymore than the old 12" crowd liked the switch to 3.75" (and many of them didn't), but it may ultimately be what brings the brand full-circle into prominence again. It's just that we'll likely be sitting on the sidelines for it. If anything, what Hasbro can be blamed for is not pulling the plug on ARAH sooner, I love ARAH and I'm glad for the product we've gotten, but in all honesty when I finally got my hands on Kwinn many months ago, it really felt like a fitting end to the era for me personally. The 50th stuff looks pretty good in a lot of cases, but I've realized I can probably live without most or all of it (at this point the only thing I have left on preorder is the Destro/Hawk/Leatherneck pack). I may be pretty close to "done" with ARAH Joe. Last edited by Jmacq1; 07-12-2014 at 11:28 AM.. |
07-12-2014, 11:40 AM | #62 |
Iron Grenadier
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 916
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Quote:
But the toyline hit on a few of the kid interests. Ninja's and fun characters. GI Joe did the Ninja revamp with Retaliation but did not hit on a more vibrant character line that would bring kids on board. I really want a GI Joe revival but the Renegades cartoon proved that a show can not carry a line. Yet you are so correct, nothing is guaranteed. Bandia tried to revamp Thundercats and it did not work. I wish I knew what a fix could be but I am all out of ideals. Kids are so fickle these days.
Which makes me wonder how the economics of it would work out to just cut out the traditional cable route and go something like a Netflix exclusive. It seems like with services such as Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon Prime scrambling for exclusives that we are starting to see more and more cartoon series that wouldn't show up on Cartoon Network, Nick Toons, or Toon Disney. |
07-12-2014, 11:46 AM | #63 |
Crimson Nerd
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 12,573
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Quote:
I think part of the problem for Thudercats was Cartoon Network. The network has a lot of problems and it seems like so many promising cartoons have been brought down with those problems.
Which makes me wonder how the economics of it would work out to just cut out the traditional cable route and go something like a Netflix exclusive. It seems like with services such as Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon Prime scrambling for exclusives that we are starting to see more and more cartoon series that wouldn't show up on Cartoon Network, Nick Toons, or Toon Disney. Or put another way: For most brands/cartoons, they need Cartoon Network more than Cartoon Network needs them. With Clone Wars, CN was dealing with a brand/corporation bigger than they are, so that gave Lucasfilm the negotiating power. That's the reason I kinda scoff every time someone posts "We need a new G.I. Joe toon but it's gotta be on Cartoon Network!" Because Hasbro can't MAKE Cartoon network air their show. Much less control when it gets aired, and Cartoon Network has no vested interested in helping boost the Joe brand (in fact, given their treatment of G.I. Joe over the years I think it's safe to say CN doesn't care for G.I. Joe at all). The Hub is basically the ONLY channel Hasbro can guarantee will pick up a new Joe Cartoon. Everyone else, they have to beg. Last edited by Jmacq1; 07-12-2014 at 12:00 PM.. |
07-12-2014, 01:17 PM | #64 |
Hisstank.Com General
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Secret underground complex
Posts: 6,975
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Quote:
Never fails...the same folks assuming Hasbro is a bunch of complete incompetents who don't care about G.I. Joe while completely ignoring the multitude of attempts to revitalize the brand that Hasbro has attempted over the last 10 years, to varying degrees of success, but ultimately not enough in the long term.
It's the brand coupled with the waning prominence of 3 3/4" action figures as a whole. Even Star Wars and Marvel are starting to languish now. At this rate I'm not going to be at all surprised if the toys from Star Wars Episodes VII - IX become the last gasp of the 3 3/4" action figure market before it shifts entirely to "niche product" status. Where the brand is concerned, it simply doesn't seem to click with kids, for whatever reason. As others have posited, a ground-up reboot probably has more likelihood of catching on big-time than yet another retread of 80's ARAH, no matter how well-done it is. Folks also like to forget that for the most part G.I. Joe has consistently been on shelves for the better part of 30 years. That is EXTREMELY rare for a toyline. The brand as a whole has been a success, but I've reached the point where I firmly believe that it's time for Hasbro to cut the cord and move entirely into the next phase of G.I. Joe...that may be a phase that we old timers don't like anymore than the old 12" crowd liked the switch to 3.75" (and many of them didn't), but it may ultimately be what brings the brand full-circle into prominence again. It's just that we'll likely be sitting on the sidelines for it. If anything, what Hasbro can be blamed for is not pulling the plug on ARAH sooner, I love ARAH and I'm glad for the product we've gotten, but in all honesty when I finally got my hands on Kwinn many months ago, it really felt like a fitting end to the era for me personally. The 50th stuff looks pretty good in a lot of cases, but I've realized I can probably live without most or all of it (at this point the only thing I have left on preorder is the Destro/Hawk/Leatherneck pack). I may be pretty close to "done" with ARAH Joe. It is interesting that the Guardians of the Galaxy toys cover the full range of scales. I believe that the vehicles are for the smallest scale figs, which look terrible. Maybe a crappy fig but a really cool vehicle will be the wave of the future. However, ARAH Joe started out as a vehicle line where the figs were supposed to highlight the vehicles. Ultimately, the figs eclipsed the vehicles in popularity, and they took up less shelf space. I think the future will be higher priced collectors lines in 4" and 6" scale at mass market but also DTC. All the rest of the 4" offerings will be movie related 5 POA figs. I don't think there will be anything in between. |
07-12-2014, 01:41 PM | #65 |
Cobra Viper
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: New Braunfels, TX
Posts: 389
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I am all about someone making a TPS game for G.I. Joe, and I would love for it to include mini-missions done in the style of old Side-Scrolling Platform Shooters, and maybe even Top Down Shooter driving/flying stages. I think it would give it an extra added nostalgia factor. Imagine a game like Strider or Castlevania, only starring Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow, or a game like Spy Hunter, except you are playing as Clutch Behind the wheel of the VAMP, with each stage having a different driver and vehicle.
Joe and Cobra characters both being playable is a must, and there would have to be a staggering amount of weapons and vehicles. I'd actually buy a modern gaming system if there a G.I. Joe. game like this, and it was good. |
07-12-2014, 01:49 PM | #66 |
Hisstank.Com General
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Secret underground complex
Posts: 6,975
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Quote:
I am all about someone making a TPS game for G.I. Joe, and I would love for it to include mini-missions done in the style of old Side-Scrolling Platform Shooters, and maybe even Top Down Shooter driving/flying stages. I think it would give it an extra added nostalgia factor. Imagine a game like Strider or Castlevania, only starring Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow, or a game like Spy Hunter, except you are playing as Clutch Behind the wheel of the VAMP, with each stage having a different driver and vehicle.
Joe and Cobra characters both being playable is a must, and there would have to be a staggering amount of weapons and vehicles. I'd actually buy a modern gaming system if there a G.I. Joe. game like this, and it was good. |
07-12-2014, 03:24 PM | #67 |
Tanker
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 1,047
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Suggesting that a cartoon is "must have" is bull. There have been a ridiculous amount of toy lines with a cartoon and/or movies... and they stagnated.
I don't think the brand or Hasbro has failed either. There is a market for it... or did we all conveniently forget the last 7 years? With that in mind, how many of us joined hisstank.com after the 25th Anniversary was spotted at retail. I did. I will however suggest that Hasbro is having a very rough time deciding where the brand is headed. Tastes change. In a few years when Star Wars is back in swing, Transformers and ninjas will probably fade to the background and wait for their "next turn". Rant over.
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07-13-2014, 03:14 AM | #68 |
Iron Grenadier
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 945
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Quote:
If anything, what Hasbro can be blamed for is not pulling the plug on ARAH sooner, I love ARAH and I'm glad for the product we've gotten, but in all honesty when I finally got my hands on Kwinn many months ago, it really felt like a fitting end to the era for me personally. The 50th stuff looks pretty good in a lot of cases, but I've realized I can probably live without most or all of it (at this point the only thing I have left on preorder is the Destro/Hawk/Leatherneck pack). I may be pretty close to "done" with ARAH Joe.
In 2003 Spy Troops, hardly a collector-focused line but still RAH, generated $88 million in revenue for Hasbro. That was a pretty kid friendly line with two figures together ready to battle and at really great prices even for that time: Marketing Strategy - O. C. Ferrell, Michael Hartline - Google Books Compare that to the approximate $30 million the clearly collector focused 25th Anniversary through Modern Era line that the brand generated in 2008, based on Hasbro's comments in regards to the $100 million expected in 2009 for Rise of Cobra. Hasbro third-quarter profit rises 8.8 percent - Business - US business - Earnings | NBC News Is RAH the problem, or is trying to keep adult collectors happy? Now, I agree that Hasbro should move on from RAH and create a new version of G.I. Joe for today the same way they did with RAH in the 80's, I just don't believe RAH is the primary problem. Hasbro just continues to miss the mark since moving over the collector-focused 25th style figures of how to make it work in the market. Last edited by backhawkdown; 07-13-2014 at 03:17 AM.. |
07-13-2014, 12:05 PM | #69 |
Commando
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Dirty South
Posts: 2,477
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Military toys and themes are just out of favor right now. We've been at war for the last decade and I constantly see parents (including my brother) in stores denying their kid's interest in guns or military toys. They won't buy any of the Nerf blasters and sometimes won't allow the water guns either. Transformers, comic properties, medieval and space type themes are fantasy so they're allowed. Strange that my brother and I both came from a home with GI Joe, were exposed to and loved the same movies yet he's liberal and I'm conservative.
It's hard to disagree that Hasbro has made multiple attempts at relaunching the brand in the media. You simply keep throwing lawn darts until one hits. Valor vs Venom, Spytroops, Sigma 6 all had animated content. Creatively, I appreciate the work the Avatar: The Last Airbender creators did on Resolute but that was just a one shot. Stylistically, it looked great and was the best modern take on what GI Joe could be. The renegades just looked awful, with a tired A-Team concept saddled on a seldom watched network with a matching toy that was too late to the game. The problem is you never really know what will catch on with kids. The best a company could do is look at what's successful in other brands and try to emulate the themes with their own intellectual property. I think a good relaunch for Joe would be a clean slate. Start with a military training academy where a few students are selected as the gifted elite group and asked to participate in actual missions. I think it's important the characters are youthful for kids to identify with them. Maybe allow some of the instructors to be ARAH characters (a nice hat tip to older fans) and let a new generation take the wheel. There will be learning lessons built into the episodes that teach about loyalty, friendship, self reliance, etc. I don't see any issue in bringing real world terror issues into play. After all, Cobra was a terrorist organization in 1982. Take out the world domination and add in a fundamentalist anarchist group in Cobra for the sake of chaos and instability. One of my most favorite TV series was the relaunch of BSG and they were constantly pulling in relevant current world issues into the plot lines. Maybe animation isn't the way to go and live action series could work. I hate to say it but CW programming seems to be very popular with kids and they have a formula that they apply that seems to work on multiple shows. That 100 show did well and it had guns, explosions and violence with a lot of CGI going on.
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07-16-2014, 01:07 PM | #70 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,231
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Quote:
I think a good relaunch for Joe would be a clean slate. Start with a military training academy where a few students are selected as the gifted elite group and asked to participate in actual missions. I think it's important the characters are youthful for kids to identify with them. Maybe allow some of the instructors to be ARAH characters (a nice hat tip to older fans) and let a new generation take the wheel. There will be learning lessons built into the episodes that teach about loyalty, friendship, self reliance, etc.
That's a pretty cool idea actually. The making Cobra an evil company angle seemed like the safest way to handle them without calling them terrorists or anything too real-world that would scare away moms. I think watching shows like GI Joe didn't really affect political leanings since they didn't really delve into political topics. |
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