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02-18-2009, 04:55 PM | #2841 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Quote:
Besides Oliver, who else keeps the sub-teams intact?
I tend to break 'em up, or reassign, since the way Hasbro set up most of 'em isn't the most effiecient use of characters. I would replace Crazylegs in Night Force with Muskrat, for example. Like Flint and Duke can't be everywhere, so which "team" gets priority? I never bought any of the sub team guys unless it was a new character, and the ones I've picked up over the years have mostly been headswapped out. That being said. Most of the Night-Force guys had better color schemes than the originals, but I couldn't spend the money or I was out of the country. |
02-18-2009, 05:00 PM | #2842 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hope, ME
Posts: 4,735
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I was really looking forward to the Night Force Falcon that was rumored for wave 14, in the hopes that he'd be of better quality than the comic pack one as well as having the cool color scheme.
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02-18-2009, 05:03 PM | #2843 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
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Yeah, I was hoping for Night Force Falcon as well. Still holding out hope for that wave that had NF Falcon, Resolute Storm Shadow, BD B.A.T. and what looked like TF Roadblock.
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02-18-2009, 05:59 PM | #2844 |
I Ride with Claymore!!!
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Alexandria, Virginia
Posts: 6,821
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If they do make a Night Force Falcon, I hope they use this new Recondo mold and they need to fix his arms. He also really needs his scarf. I really hope we see a Night Force Falcon, but I'd also really like to see a Sonic Fighters Falcon - he was a really great urban camo figure... the gray camo with the green beret and green scarf was really cool looking.
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Why aren't there more Joes from the Deep South? And would it kill Hasbro to give us a Marine Corps Officer? |
02-18-2009, 11:28 PM | #2845 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
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I like the convention Falcon with the 3 shades camo. That was pretty cool. But I really like Night Force Falcon.
Heck, I just like Night Force period, lol. The digital-urban of the Sonic Fighter was pretty cool.
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02-18-2009, 11:35 PM | #2846 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
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Dial-Tone's Sonic Fighter had a nice urban look going on as well.
Dodger's, not so good. Pysche-Outs is horrible. Although the Sonic Fighter Pysche-Out would make a good tech character. Who else was a Sonic Fighter?
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02-19-2009, 12:39 AM | #2847 |
G.I.Joe medic
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Litchfield, ME
Posts: 3,169
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Troynos, other Sonic Fighters were Rock'n'Roll (repainted v.2) Zap, Tunnel Rat, Stalker and Hawk (Talking battle Commanders)
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02-19-2009, 03:44 AM | #2848 |
I Ride with Claymore!!!
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Alexandria, Virginia
Posts: 6,821
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Quote:
Besides Oliver, who else keeps the sub-teams intact?
I tend to break 'em up, or reassign, since the way Hasbro set up most of 'em isn't the most effiecient use of characters. I would replace Crazylegs in Night Force with Muskrat, for example. Like Flint and Duke can't be everywhere, so which "team" gets priority? First of all, Almost every sub-team (when taken as a whole roster) offers soldiers with all the necessary specialties for any mission. For example, Frostbite and Dusty may seem like odd choices for a Jungle team, and that's a fair point, but there are Jungles in the world that turn into Deserts (Africa and Australia) and Jungles that can turn into frigid areas at certain times of the year (Siberia and Mongolia and India). If Tiger Force is supposed to be able to act independently as a Quick Reaction Force, then they need specialists who are qualified to facilitate the teams transition of environments. I will certainly grant that Dusty and Frostbite would be more useful on other teams - that is why I do prioritize team membership when a certain Joe is listed on multiple rosters of different sub-teams. Let me explain, and first we have to set aside Duke, Flint, and Falcon for my Joeverse's system of Special Ops/Sub-Teams... Every Sub-team has a standard roster. This roster includes the "first string" of soldiers on it's roster. For example, Repeater is only listed as a part of Night Force. Therefore, he is listed on Night Force's roster as an "standard/starting" member of that team. Dusty, by comparison, is listed on the roster of Tiger Force and the Desert Patrol Squad. A decision is made as to which team his priority listing is assigned. It was fairly easy to determine that Dusty's first priority should be with the Desert Patrol Squad... that works by having him assigned to the DPS, but listed as a "Reserve/Qualified" member of Tiger Force that can be brought in when the mission may require his skills. Stalker is another important example of having to choose. He is listed as a member of TF and the DPS. It is certainly true that Stalker's record of service in Vietnam would seem to incline his expertise towards Jungle warfare. However, Beach-Head has been clearly established as the leader of TF by his Convention Special file card. It seemed to me that Stalker should be running his own team, and not playing second fiddle to Beach-Head. So, Stalker's primary assignment is as the leader of the DPS, and he can join TF on special assignment per mission requirements. Night Force works a little differently in my Joeverse. It's like my version of Delta Force for the Joe Team. Night Force does not officially exist, and it's roster is always quasi "ad hoc". There are certain Joes who are only assigned to Night Force, like Muskrat and Repeater and Crazy Legs. These guys do form a "skeleton crew" for Night Force that can deploy at a moment's notice. However, under normal circumstances, a Night Force mission would be planned in advance and the other members would arrive from their "normal" unit assignments. Except in rare cases (combat mission deployment), Night Force missions take priority over all other normal duty assignments and R & R. Duke and Flint cannot be tied down to any one unit, or even the entire Special Ops Command. They are the Senior Warrant Officer and Senior NCO of the entire team. Yet, they are qualified for every team under Special Ops command, and can work with/advise any team per mission requirements. So, if Flint is tasked by Hawk to accompany Night Force on a mission for a specific purpose - Flint puts on his Night Force uniform and joins the team for that mission as a fully qualified member of the unit. If Duke needs to accompany Tiger Force into the Jungle for a specific reason, he gets on his Tiger Force BDU's and hops to it. Duke and Flint float as the mission requires. Falcon is the Commanding Officer of all the Sub-Teams (with the exception of Ghost Squad, which is under the direction of Claymore). Falcon has a uniform for nearly every Sub-team, and oversees their operation. So, for example, Beach-Head is the field commander of Tiger Force, but he reports directly to Falcon. Falcon has a Tiger Force uniform, and he can inspect and assume command as he sees fit. The same is true for the DPS and Sky Patrol and Steel Brigade. Falcon personally commands Night Force, as the most elite of the sub-teams, Falcon personally assumes direct command for every Night Force Operation. Ghost Squad works differently - it is the S.A.D. equivalent of the Joe Team, and it "doesn't exist" as a part of Claymore's intelligence Black Ops office. All the members are recruited from Night Force, and the unit is led in the Field by Flint... These missions are completely "off book" and often illegal. No Commissioned Officer can be affiliated with these operations. Falcon is apprised of the mission, and offers support from Night Force if needed, but if any Officer leads them into the field, it's Claymore. These missions are completely planned and executed by Claymore based on a very vague direction by Hawk or Colton from the President: The President might say to Hawk, "In a perfect world, the President of Iran would be someone more reasonable." Hawk would mention the conversation to Claymore with certain code phrases in a certain location, and the rest is up to Claymore: Take out the President of Iran. Now all that being said, the Sub-Teams have provided me a wonderful structure to build upon. My entire Special Operations Command was based on trying to organize around these sub-teams. It also provided me a very easy way to organize my entire Joe roster... the pieces just fell into place. It also helps me to be familiar with a greater number of characters. I don't use Beach-Head in every mission - he's tied up Sierra Gordo, in a command slot. He's used in a very important, and active team. Stalker doesn't get used in every mission - he's in the Desert. But when I use Stalker, I don't have to decide between who is cooler for what mission objective, Stalker or Beach-Head. This system allows me to not trip over their feet. It gives major Characters room. It also allows Flint and Duke to continue to hold the entire team together, and to act as the focal points of the Joeverse. They are the lynch pins - the right and left hands of the Commander. It also recognizes Falcon as the Commander he should be and gives him a hugely important role in the Joeverse. I promoted him to Captain (I also promoted Claymore to Major). Sub-Teams work for me. They are, in many ways, the building blocks of my whole command structure. And when I look and the complete rosters of each team that Hasbro provides, they make a lot of sense to me. Sure, there's some weirdness and some redundancy, but there's weirdness and redundancy in the real military... in a lot of ways, it makes it pretty realistic: it's not a perfect system, but overall it more than gets the job done. That's my 2 cents. I'm very interested to see what y'all think. Thanks for being patient with this ridiculous novel of a post ;)
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Why aren't there more Joes from the Deep South? And would it kill Hasbro to give us a Marine Corps Officer? |
02-19-2009, 10:06 AM | #2849 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
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It's a great system Oliver, makes alot of sense. I didn't mean to come across as knocking on it or anything, I just knew you were pretty strict about following sub-team lines, where others don't seem to be.
I think Beachhead and Stalker are too good to be tied down to a single location. These guys are the "floaters", they go where they are needed. I like the idea of there being "complete" Joe teams across the globe for rapid response and capable of almost any mission. In my "dream" Joeverse, there would be no armor and Joe would be a true Delta Force type force. Not that big, highly skilled, able to be deployed anywhere/anytime. I have a hard time integrating the armor because of it's nature where it usually needs multiple people to be able to function. I also don't follow the uniforms. Characters with multiple uniforms get the one I like best (unless it's mission specific), which more often then not is their classic. So making 4 Assault Teams around the globe also allows me to get rid of the "if have the Mauler, why keep the MOBAT" discussion. Each vehicle is assigned to a location/terrain/environment it would be best suited for. The MOBAT is smaller, but still packs a punch, so it works better then the Mauler in a more close-quarters environment like a jungle. The special operations guys are floaters, they'd be stationed on the Flagg and the new Joe Freighter (some kind of fast boat that can transport people and equipment). They can go where needed and for whatever mission is needed. My thinking is that at any given time, at least 1/2 the Joe team is deployed on a mission of some kind. This is where the cross-training/secondaries come into play. Dusty and Frostbite are cross-trained to assist the jungle team on a "per mission" basis. Scarlett is a "back-up" sniper. If any of the snipers are busy on assignments and an immediate mission comes up, Scarlett can be assigned to it. The repaints and multiple outfits are used to make new characters to fill in the holes that are missing. This isn't how I originally did it, but it's what my Joeverse is evolving into due to this thread and discussions. I love the idea of your Ghost Squad.
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02-19-2009, 10:07 AM | #2850 |
#voteblackjack
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Northwood, NH
Posts: 35,747
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Quote:
Law looks good, I like Tunnel Rat. Not big fan of Hawk, Stalker and Rock 'n Roll but they're not terrible. Zap is pretty cool.
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Join the New England G.I. Joe Collector's Group: Battleforce New England Join the March of Cobra. Read the epic adventure on Kindle Worlds and visit the page to learn more. https://www.facebook.com/marchofcobra/ Last edited by Troynos; 02-19-2009 at 10:09 AM.. |
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