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07-23-2016, 11:20 AM | #21091 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
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Quote:
Interrupting for just a moment....
I am finalizing (hopefully) my Joe organization and wanted some advice. I am going to make my Troops have a four-man HQ element but wasn't sure on the actual assault team size. Here is what I have for options: 14-man Troop (One 4-man HQ, Two 5-man assault teams) 18-man Troop (One 4-man HQ, Two 5-man assault teams, one 4-man sniper team) 16-man Troop (One 4-man HQ, two 6-man assault teams) 20-man Troop (One 4-man HQ, two 6-man assault teams, one 4-man sniper team) I didn't know whether to integrate my sniper teams onto a Troop, make them their own Troop or assign them to my ISR Squadron (along with HUMINT and Recce elements). Also I have my Recce Troop that perform special reconnaissance (characters such as Stalker, Gung-Ho, Sneak Peek, Recoil, etc) but due to the lack of SCUBA- and HALO-qualified Joes I may need to just integrate them into my Troops. So my dilemma is do my regular Troops perform both Direct Action and Special Reconnaissance missions or should I keep my Troops as doing Direct Action and my Recce Troop performing Special Reconnaissance? EDIT: I forgot to add, I was thinking of making the Troops smaller (14-man) so they could easily tack on additional support, such as EOD, HUMINT, CBRN, MWD, etc. This might make the Troop more mobile and discreet, instead of having 30 or more people operating at the same time on missions that it might be advisable to lessen the numbers. |
07-23-2016, 11:26 AM | #21092 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
|
I like the 16-man concept (including HQ) because it also breaks down into four 4-man teams. That allows for four teams to secure four corners of a building, or perhaps a heavy stack of 8 men hits the first floor and a stack of 4 hits the rooftop with the last 4 providing sniper over watch. Or 4 in the front door, 4 in the rear, 4 on the roof, and 4 for support. For recon, you could have at least four 4-man teams or two 6-man teams and a 4-man HQ in support. All kinds of combinations are possible.
Four 4-man teams can infiltrate via 4 MH-6 Little Birds or one 16-man troop with combat load in an MH-60. If seaborne, then two 8-man teams in two special ops water-crafts works well. Four combat-loaded men per CRRC. Plus you have wet-submersibles that may not support 20+. Last edited by Tanksmasher; 07-23-2016 at 11:35 AM.. |
07-23-2016, 02:42 PM | #21093 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh, Pa
Posts: 2,998
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Quote:
I like the 16-man concept (including HQ) because it also breaks down into four 4-man teams. That allows for four teams to secure four corners of a building, or perhaps a heavy stack of 8 men hits the first floor and a stack of 4 hits the rooftop with the last 4 providing sniper over watch. Or 4 in the front door, 4 in the rear, 4 on the roof, and 4 for support. For recon, you could have at least four 4-man teams or two 6-man teams and a 4-man HQ in support. All kinds of combinations are possible.
Four 4-man teams can infiltrate via 4 MH-6 Little Birds or one 16-man troop with combat load in an MH-60. If seaborne, then two 8-man teams in two special ops water-crafts works well. Four combat-loaded men per CRRC. Plus you have wet-submersibles that may not support 20+. |
07-23-2016, 02:57 PM | #21094 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,294
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I've been having problems with my troop structure too, I keep changing them around. Last week I had;
Troop HQ - Troop Commander - Troop NCO - Troop Ops / Intel NCO - Troop Communicator - Troop Medic Assault Team 1 (Assault Element) - Team Commander - x 4 Assaulters Assault Team 2 (Support or Assault Element 2) - Team Commander - x 4 Assaulters Assault Team 3 (Security Element) - Team Commander - x 4 Assaulters Sniper / Recce Team - Team Commander / Chief Sniper - x 3 Snipers So 24 guys that can be turned into 4 six man teams, 6 four man teams etc. BUT!!! I changed this the other day to better reflect my Joe verse's mission of DA, SR and Counter WMD and the vehicles I have so; Troop HQ - Troop Commander - Troop NCO - Troop Communicator - Troop Medic - x 2 Assault Teams of 8 men (can be split into 2 Bricks of 4) - x 1 Recce / Sniper Team of 4 men So with HQ added, x 3 teams of 8 men or x6 teams of 4 men. This new structure is based on an Australian Tactical Assault Platoon. That said, after reading Tank's response I'm thinking of going back to a 16 man troop which I had from 2009-2014/15 |
07-23-2016, 03:44 PM | #21095 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: over here
Posts: 2,092
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Good suggestions Tank. Yeah I thought about infiltration methods as well. I was thinking on a mobile scale, where you would want a minimum of three people per vehicle (vehicle commander, driver and gunner). With sixteen men you could could with four vehicles of four men each.
I had also thought of inserting by Blackhawk helicopters as well. In my fanfic the first mission my Joes employ on has one 16-man Troop plus six support Joes (MWD, EOD, snipers) inserting via two Blackhawks (12 per helicopter) to conduct a direct action mission. Two snipers stay back on each helicopter leaving 20 men on the ground. A further four (plus one dog) stand guard while the other 16 break up into two 8-man teams to enter in the front and back doors of a warehouse. The two 8-man teams further break down into four 4-man teams. So if we go by a 16-man Troop, where would the snipers be assigned? Would they be integrated within the 16-man Troop or would they be part of their own Troop (which Delta seems to do)? Obviously if part of their own Troop they could be assigned to an Assault Troop as needed (increasing the number past 16). Or let's say a 16-man Troop has four snipers within it, that would leave twelve soldiers for direct action missions while the other four provide cover. |
07-23-2016, 04:27 PM | #21096 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
|
If the you look at USN SEALs and Army Special Forces, you have snipers within the basic platoon and ODA, so why not include them in an assault team for versatility. My understanding is that Delta doesn't just have a sniper troop, it's a Recon/Sniper troop. Recon requires different skill sets such that you may want one troop to specialize in that alone and snipers with their training can obviously work in that group, but in SRT and SWAT and VBSS and other CQB units the best assaulters receive sniper training, so I'm gonna guess and say that Delta has sniper-trained operators in the Assault Troops as well. That would seem logical and would provide intrinsic sniper support if needed.
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07-23-2016, 04:42 PM | #21097 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
|
As the smallest unit, four men can act as a
Fire team: Team Leader Grenadier SAW Rifleman Assault team: Pointman Team Leader/Breacher Shooter Shooter/Security Recon team: Team Leader RTO/Sniper JTAC/RTO Sniper/Scout Sniper team: Senior Sniper Senior Observer Sniper Observer Unconventional Warfare team: Communicator Demo Man Medic Weapons Man Vehicle crew: Driver/Pilot/Coxswain Navigator Gunner Assistant Gunner HQ section: CO XO / SNCO RTO Medic Last edited by Tanksmasher; 07-23-2016 at 04:46 PM.. |
07-23-2016, 05:07 PM | #21098 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: over here
Posts: 2,092
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^^^ Excellent breakdown on four-man units!
So do you think Delta's Sniper/Recce Troops have some recon-quailified members who are not sniper-trained? I have a separate JTAC team that is part of my Combat Support Squadron that deploys with a Troop or Squadron when needed. I am wondering if I should just integrate them within a Troop (maybe make them the Troop Communicators)? |
07-23-2016, 05:52 PM | #21099 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
|
SEALs and SF have JTAC qualified guys so I don't see why not. It's quite possible that there are some non snipers in the Recon Troop but I imagine most eventually pursue sniper training. The SEALs have a sniper/recon unit that has scouts and scout/snipers. A sniper is really just a recon scout trained to be an exceptional marksman, so it's kind of the next logical step in a scout's career, although not necessarily mandatory. Senior scouts are typically the first to be offered the training. Given Delta's professionalism and level of training though, I wouldn't be surprised if all the recon guys are snipers too.
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07-24-2016, 02:22 AM | #21100 |
Commando
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Britain
Posts: 3,827
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Flying Scorpion loves the sound of anti-aircraft guns trying to hit him, it’s music to his ears because once he touches down, he knows where to find his targets. He’s favoured attack is from behind! He moves like lightning, even if the Commandos think him a coward!
“As a child, Flying Scorpion liked to ring the doorbells of houses and, as the occupant came to the door, he’d run around back and steal whatever he could; bicycles, balls, buckets, clothing, even bird cages and puppies!” |
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