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05-08-2016, 08:50 PM | #20821 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Yeah that made little sense, but he's in the military so he may have heard some things?
Maybe when the Joes had to commandeer the Jane which Cutter was the Captain he wasn't a Joe. After that mission then he pushed his congressman to get him on the team. Doesn't lend itself to making many friends, but the WHALE had quite a few missions when Cutter joined the team. Plus being a Red Sox fan probably help intregrate Cutter since so many Joes are Rhode Islanders, and I assume Predominantly Red Sox fans.
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05-08-2016, 09:56 PM | #20822 |
I.O. SpecOps
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: In a secret underground bunker.
Posts: 4,404
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Doc tried to get a guaranteed slot in G.I. Joe before he even enlisted. It's hard to reconcile the fact that they were so secret that no on at Ft. Wadsworth knew their true purpose, but a civilian med student did. Did his recruiter have to get a higher security clearance after asking his higher ups "What's this G.I. Joe this guy keeps asking to join?"?
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05-09-2016, 02:16 AM | #20823 |
Commando
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Britain
Posts: 3,827
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Doc's filecard wasn't written by Hama was it? I think his, and some later ones where people are said to have wanted to join GI Joe have to be chalked off as in error.
I think the public are aware of the team's existance even if it's little beyond that. Hama retconned it that they were secret in his IDW continuation, ISTR reading, but in his Marvel run they're openly discussed on the news in the story set after the Cobra Island Civil War, as well as in the story 'Beached WHALE' in the mid 20s or so, where some fishermen are taking the mick and one says the Joes 'must be this new action army we been hearing about'. There are a few other instances where the public clearly know the team exist. |
05-09-2016, 09:40 AM | #20824 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Then there are the guys who somehow enlisted right into the Joes or Wanted to be Joes when they grew up? I have to double check. I think Skystriker, Major Altitude have some sort of nonsense like that.
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
05-09-2016, 11:14 AM | #20825 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,235
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I think it would be no more secretive than SEAL Team 6 or Delta. People know they exist but their organization, composition, and other aspects are classified. It would be impossible to keep a large military unit completely undercover. As soon as they start operating, someome is going to figure out who they are.
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05-09-2016, 12:27 PM | #20826 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,018
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Heck - as soon as someone orders a weapon, ships a tank, repairs a Skystriker, pays for fuel, pays a salary, gets medical treatment etc the organization is going to be known. That was even a plot line with Tunnel Rat and Raptor in ARAH.
The only way I could see a unit flying under the radar would be if it was one of those CIA black units hiding behind a whole bunch of front companies and cut outs, and at that point they wouldn't be getting Maulers, Skystrikers or Dragonflies. Cutter and the Jane, though, might be involved . . . There's a tangential concept here too: Is Joe an organization where the operators are hand picked, or do they go through selection? If they're hand picked then it's easier to keep a lower profile, though they'll still be known (like Blue Light and the early days of SEAL Team 6), but will be less widely advertised than if they run selection (like Delta and DEVGRU). ARAH seemed to suggest that Joe was a handpicked team in the early days, and then developed a selection course later in its existence. |
05-10-2016, 08:50 PM | #20827 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: over here
Posts: 2,092
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Quote:
Heck - as soon as someone orders a weapon, ships a tank, repairs a Skystriker, pays for fuel, pays a salary, gets medical treatment etc the organization is going to be known. That was even a plot line with Tunnel Rat and Raptor in ARAH.
The only way I could see a unit flying under the radar would be if it was one of those CIA black units hiding behind a whole bunch of front companies and cut outs, and at that point they wouldn't be getting Maulers, Skystrikers or Dragonflies. Cutter and the Jane, though, might be involved . . . There's a tangential concept here too: Is Joe an organization where the operators are hand picked, or do they go through selection? If they're hand picked then it's easier to keep a lower profile, though they'll still be known (like Blue Light and the early days of SEAL Team 6), but will be less widely advertised than if they run selection (like Delta and DEVGRU). ARAH seemed to suggest that Joe was a handpicked team in the early days, and then developed a selection course later in its existence. That's what I am trying to determine for my Joe team, are they hand-picked or go through selection? I was thinking of having them start out as being hand-picked, especially in regards to the Original 13. I can make a case for nearly all of them being either former Special Forces or 75th Rangers except for Grunt. If he is an Infantryman MOS with no Ranger School training how would he be hand-picked to participate in an elite organization? So maybe go with all of them going through selection? If that is the case who would be the people to run the selection course? Basically they would be "Joes' before the Original 13, so who would they be? EDIT: Forgot to add that hand-picked soldiers for a new organization would most likely come from either the SF or the 75th (and other elite units), hence my question about Grunt. My case for the other Original 13 would be: Hawk: Air Defense Artillery Officer turned Special Forces Officer Steeler: Armor Officer that served in a Cavalry Unit Stalker: Special Forces Medic Snake-Eyes: Special Forces Engineer Breaker: Special Forces Communications Flash: Special Forces Communications (nod to a later filecard) Zap: Special Forces Engineer Short-Fuze: Special Forces Weapons Rock'n'Roll: Infantryman serving in the 75th Clutch: Infantryman serving in the 75th Grand Slam: Fire Support Specialist serving in the 75th (attended JTAC training while in the Regiment) Scarlett: Military Intelligence Last edited by john shaft; 05-10-2016 at 08:56 PM.. Reason: Clarification |
05-10-2016, 09:55 PM | #20828 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Nice that maked a lot of sense. I would swap Rock'n'Roll and Short-fuze but that's just me. The beard just screams Green Beret more than almost any Joe. Plus Rangers use mortars and have fire teams the Green Berets do not.
Grunt would need something else to overcompensate for his lack of spec Ops background. Like he won every meritorious award through boot camp and rated high in every single aptitude test so they didn't know where to stick him because he was good at everything. Every drill Sgt and instructor who had him put him at the top of their list of outstanding recruit. Marksmanship, pistol, jump, Demolitions training, vehicle maintenance, artillery coordinator, small arms maintenance. Every Special Ops unit wanted him the Joes just got him first. Everyone wanted him as a Ranger or Green Beret, or Cavalry Scout Pathfinder, but Hawk wanted him for him. A jack of all trades who is good at everything he does, and never quits. Extremely loyal and is not into titles. I imagine after Grunt left went to MIT or Georgia Tech? as an electrical engineer and then came back his role would change. He may have gone to become an officer? I could see him staying enlisted as well, but why get that degree and not put it to use. I would say the Joes Armourer, small arms designer as well as a Squad leader. He's a Joe and he doesn't need to be anything else and I bet that is exactly what Hawk wanted.
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
05-10-2016, 10:06 PM | #20829 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,018
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^ Well the thing about hand-picking is that they typically come from a small community. Blue Light all came from 5th Group. 6 came from the relatively small SEAL community. Joe seems to come from all over . . . though if you look at the time period it's plausible that they came from MACV-SOG (BL after all had a number of Son Tay raiders, and 6 initially consisted of 'Nam vets, so the timeline isn't that big a stretch . . . it's a shorter timeline than starting a new unit today with guys who rode horses in Afghanistan in '02). Or maybe some of Stalker's first picks were a little too old to join a new unit but had become instructors and slipped some names to Stalker and Hawk. Maybe Grunt was on the same Basic course as Rock n Roll. When Stalker picked Rock, Rock turned to him and said "Hey - I know this guy. He got [pick a light infantry division] instead of Ranger, but man was he hot . . . and frosty - both at the same time!" Stalker pulled his jacket, liked what he saw, and in he came. Or maybe he was out on the same XAFV-project that is where, presumably, Steeler caught someone's eye.
Anyway, why the need to do Ranger training? The guy is highly motivated, cool under pressure, and he can fix weapons and call for artillery - those are characteristics and skills in high demand in any unit. |
05-10-2016, 10:53 PM | #20830 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,235
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Yeah, I think after Grunt came back they made him a squad leader, didn't they? Staff Sergeant? Seems like they should've made him an officer, leading his own platoon, or perhaps Special Forces.
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