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03-27-2016, 07:45 AM | #20661 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,018
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Quote:
I think the Black Berets are still part of the grooming standard. I need to pay closer attention when I see army guys walking around.
Back to Recondo. I'm not sure what it is supposed to be. My 10 year old mind automatically associated that patch with 1St Cavalry, but it surely isn't. I wonder what Rudat was going for: https://arealamericanbook.wordpress....sentation-art/ Quote:
Yeah I thought the same thing. I remember thinking Recondo was Australian and his rifle was something else more European, besides it being a M-14. Especially since the mention of the Swedish K. I mean who in the US military even gets to use those except Special Forces?
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03-27-2016, 03:55 PM | #20662 |
EQ-Viper
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,343
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It's interesting that Recondo has what appears to be the Navy & Marine Corps Parachutist Insignia on his left chest in that concept sketch. There were probably more of these Navy/Marine design elements that never made it into the final products (Ron Rudat came from a Navy/Marine Corps family from what I recall).
EDIT: I just looked up pictures of the vintage Recondo figure from 1984 and it does look like the insignia made it into the production toy. Considering the degree to which we dissect these sort of things, I'm surprised it doesn't get brought up more often (or maybe it does and I just missed those times). EDIT 2: And of course, Duke is another one of Rudat's "secret Marines/SEALs." Dude has the Navy & Marine Corps Parachutist Insignia on his chest as well. EDIT 3: And while Repeater was released after Rudat had left Hasbro, the figure had the Navy & Marine Corps Parachutist Insignia pinned under the Ranger tab on his cap. Maybe he was a holdover design from the Rudat era. Last edited by zuludelta; 03-27-2016 at 04:21 PM.. |
03-27-2016, 05:22 PM | #20663 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,219
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It could be also that some designers assumed the parachutist badges between branches were universal. If they saw one kind, perhaps they thought all were the same.
It also appears Sideshow corrected the badge and gave it the Army's curved wings. Last edited by Tanksmasher; 03-27-2016 at 05:27 PM.. |
03-27-2016, 06:02 PM | #20664 |
EQ-Viper
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,343
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That's likely very true in the case of the later figures. Rudat is on record saying that he's something of a militaria buff and collector, though, so I imagine these little Easter eggs are all deliberate on his part.
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03-27-2016, 06:48 PM | #20665 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toxo-Zombie Land
Posts: 1,728
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Figures of Dusty have been made with both tan and red berets, which I thought was interesting. (There was also a black beret version, but I believe this was "Dusty II", an entirely different character.)
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03-27-2016, 08:52 PM | #20666 |
EQ-Viper
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,343
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It's also pretty funny how Rudat's penchant for mixing badges and insignia from different services ended up influencing how Hama wrote certain filecards. Hama explained away Mainframe having the Army combat infantryman badge and the USMC globe & anchor on his helmet and the 3rd Marine Division patch as his being a Vietnam War veteran who later reenlisted with the Marines (I think at the time, the conflict in Grenada had yet to be added to the list of qualifying operations for award of the Army's CIB).
And the fact that Crankcase has the SAS' "Pegasus patch" on his right sleeve is referenced in the filecard as Crankcase having cross-trained with the SAS as part of a NATO exchange program. It's weird that he did that for those two characters but didn't for others, though. Maybe he wasn't paying as much attention to the sculpt/tampo details on the other figures. |
03-28-2016, 09:58 AM | #20667 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,294
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Sorry, just catching up with the thread over the last few weeks, can I go back to the medics for a second please?
I just want to get it straight in my head and please let me know if I'm wrong, barking up the wrong tree, etc. In terms of SOF Medics in the US, there are; Special Operations Combat Medic (SOCM) Phase II - which SF 18D Medics and USN SEALs attend (and MARSOC / Recon attached IDC / SARC can attend after their first deployment) Special Operations Combat Medic (SOCM) Phase I - which all Ranger, SF, Civil Affairs, PSYOP, Support Battalion, 160th SOAR, SEAL,SWCC Boat and MARSOC / Force Recon Independent Duty Corpsman & SARCs attend and only the SF 18 Series, SEALs graduate and attend Phase II And PJ's have their own course concentrating on Trauma Medicine (where SOCM Phase II offers basic dental, veterinary and sick call) Does that sound right to you guys? Last edited by Tyroc; 03-28-2016 at 10:00 AM.. |
03-28-2016, 02:12 PM | #20668 |
Commando
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Britain
Posts: 3,809
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I've expanded the roster of the GI Joe team for my Black Sword fanfic. I'm kicking around some new ideas for a sequel....
Hawk – Colonel – CO Duke – Sergeant-Major – Green Beret – Senior NCO Flint – Green Beret – Sergeant Beach Head – Ranger – Sergeant Stalker – Green Beret – Sergeant Snake Eyes – Delta Force – Sergeant Grunt – Ranger – Sergeant Zap – Ranger – Anti-tank weapons – sergeant Lowlight – Green Beret – Sniper – sergeant Scarlett – CIA officer – Intelligence specialist Mainframe – US Army – computer specialist Breaker – Ranger radio operator – Specialist Dial-Tone – Ranger radio operator – Specialist Falcon – Green Beret – Lieutenant (XO) Leatherneck – US Marine rifleman – Gunnery Sergeant Gung-Ho – US Marine rifleman – Gunnery Sergeant Wet-Suit – US Navy SEAL – Petty Officer Torpedo – US Navy SEAL – Master Chief Petty Officer Tracker – US Navy SEAL – Petty Officer Shipwreck – SWCC Coxswain – Chief Petty Officer Wild Bill – 160th SOAR helicopter pilot – Warrant Officer Lift-Ticket – 160th SOAR helo pilot – Chief Warrant Officer Clutch – Ranger vehicle driver – Sergeant Crankcase – Ranger vehicle driver – Corporal Spearhead – Ranger point-man – Sergeant Hit&Run – Delta Force – sergeant Recoil – Ranger – sergeant Hollow-point – US Marine Scout-sniper – Sergeant Airborne – Ranger – Sergeant Doc – US Army medic – Captain Lifeline – US Navy Corpsman – Petty Officer Lady Jaye – Intelligence Support Activity – undercover operations Footloose – Ranger – Sergeant Rock’n’Roll – Ranger machine gunner – Corporal Roadblock – Green Beret machine gunner – Sergeant Short-Fuse – Ranger Mortars – Sergeant Ripcord – Ranger – Staff Sergeant Crazy Legs – Ranger – Sergeant Freefall – Ranger – Sergeant Ambush – Delta Force – Sergeant – Sniper Chuckles – CIA Depth-charge – Navy SEAL – Petty Officer Major Altitude – USMC helo pilot – Major Updraft – USMC helo pilot – Captain Cloudburst – USN helo pilot – Ensign Windmill – USN helo pilot – Lieutenant Wet Down – Navy SEAL – Chief Petty Officer Night Fox – Navy SEAL – Petty Officer Cross Hair – Ranger sniper – Sergeant Bazooka – Ranger anti-armour – Sergeant Downtown – Ranger mortars – Corporal Repeater – Ranger machine-gunner – Sergeant Salvo – Ranger anti-armour – Sergeant Cover Girl – Ranger Hummer driver – Sergeant Cross Country – Ranger Hummer driver – Sergeant Claymore – Green Beret captain – Captain Side Track – Ranger – SFC Air Raid – Sky Patrol medic – Ranger – SFC Airwave – Sky Patrol communications – Ranger – Master Sgt Altitude – Sky Patrol scout – Ranger – Sergeant Drop Zone – Sky Patrol weapons specialist – Ranger – Master Sgt Skydive – Sky Patrol leader – Ranger – Sgt. Major Static Line – Sky Patrol demolitions – Ranger – SFC Pathfinder – Ranger recon – Staff Sergeant Mutt and Junkyard – Special Forces MWD and handler – Sgt Spirit – Ranger recon – Sgt Sneak-Peek – Ranger recon – Staff Sgt Outback – Special Forces survival specialist – Sgt. Muskrat – Special Forces recon – Sgt. Stretcher – Ranger medic – Sgt. Hi-Tech – Special Forces communications – Staff Sergeant Sparks – Marine Raider Radio recon signaller – Corporal Wreckage – Delta Force demolitions – Sgt. Tripwire – Ranger EOD – Sgt. Lightfoot – Ranger EOD – Sgt Heavy Duty – Ranger machine-gunner - Sgt Fast Draw – Ranger anti-armour – Sgt |
03-28-2016, 02:27 PM | #20669 |
EQ-Viper
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,343
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Quote:
Sorry, just catching up with the thread over the last few weeks, can I go back to the medics for a second please?
I just want to get it straight in my head and please let me know if I'm wrong, barking up the wrong tree, etc. In terms of SOF Medics in the US, there are; ... Does that sound right to you guys? Here's what I know, as far as the SOCM course's place within the larger Special Forces Medical Sergeant's training pipeline:
For comparison's sake, here's how the SOCM course figures in the Special Operations Civil Affairs Medical Sergeant training pipeline (SOCAMs are previously qualified healthcare specialists):
In the case of Navy corpsmen, a rated Hospital Corpsman takes the SOCM course prior to serving with Force Recon, thus earning the 8427 NEC (Fleet Marine Force Reconnaissance/Special Operations Corpsman). Later in his career, that same corpsman can take the Special Operations Independent Duty Corpsman (SOIDC) course to earn the 8403 NEC (Fleet Marine Force Reconnaissance/Special Operations Independent Duty Corpsman). The SOIDC training is in certain ways sort of the Navy equivalent of the post-SOCM follow-on training/MOS 18D-specific training for Special Forces Medical Sergeants (the SOIDC course runs for 24 weeks overall and includes classes in lab medicine, veterinary medicine, "guerrilla hospital" administration, clinical hours in ob-gyn, orthopedics, etc.). Here's how the SOCM course fits in the special operations independent duty corpsman pipeline:
SEAL medics can also take the SOIDC course anytime after they take the Special Forces Combat Diving Medical Technician course and the SOCM course (SEALs who take the SOCM are awarded NEC 5392, Naval Special Warfare Special Operations Combat Medic). I don't think they are awarded the 8403 NEC after they complete the SOIDC course, as I think that NEC is specific to the Hospital Corpsman rating, though I could be wrong about that. The Ranger medics have their own post-SOCM training, but from what I understand, it occurs at the Regiment or battalion level, and I don't have a lot of reliable public info about that. 160th SOAR medic post-SOCM training is called the Special Operations Aviation Medical Indoctrination Course, which emphasizes CASEVAC and in-flight resuscitation/trauma care over 51 hours of lectures and 29 hours of hands-on/clinical training (note that this is different from the standard Flight Medic Course and is taught in addition to the 160th SOAR medic's Combat Trauma Management training). Air Force Pararescue have their own special operations combat medicine course (they don't go to the SOCM course, although I suppose nothing is stopping a pararescueman from applying for a slot in a class if they want it), and from what I've read, they're trained with a greater emphasis on resuscitation/trauma care during in-extremis patient transfers and such. They're supposed to be the best in the "blood and guts" aspect of battlefield casualty care if you believe the peripheral chatter. There are other elite SOF medic units out there, too, but they don't get a lot of press because they're not as "sexy." There are the Special Operations Resuscitation Teams from the 528th SOSB(A), for example, and they have their own specialized post-SOCM training pipeline. What makes the SORTs unique is that they are actually led by a medical doctor who occasionally deploys/patrols with the SOCMs. The SORTs may also have nurses and other health professions as necessary. Put simply, the SORT is a forward-deployed Field Surgical Team staffed by SOCM-qualified healthcare specialists and airborne-qualified doctors and nurses. All SOF medics have to maintain their ATP (Advanced Tactical Practitioner) qualifications by taking regular refresher courses and additional classes throughout their medic careers, though, just like a civilian emergency health worker/paramedic. Last edited by zuludelta; 03-28-2016 at 03:33 PM.. Reason: typos |
03-28-2016, 05:43 PM | #20670 |
just a Marine
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: central PA
Posts: 1,681
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Regarding Duke, Recondo and others that are listed as Army yet have jump wings more like the Navy USMC wings, I always assumed those were foreign jump wings. Duke has them on his right breast which is where foreign awards are worn. Repeater's wing remind me of rigger wings worn by Army parachute riggers, why he would wear those is beyond me. I always wondered if he was meant to be a Marine because of his 8 point USN/USMC style cover. FWIW, Marines don't wear the Ranger tab so a non-reg cover with the ranger tab and jump wings is something I could see guys wearing.
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