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02-17-2016, 11:02 AM | #20411 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,018
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Going back to something discussed a dozen or so pages ago . . . what type of Green Beret training did Flint have? It's not mentioned on his file card, and this is a real stretch, but his original figure has what appears to be a couple of sticks of dynamite. So perhaps he was an engineer sergeant. If (based on his black beret and red flash) he then transitioned to Delta, the construction/blueprint part of that background would help him plan urban operations and hostage rescues, while the demolitions part of that background would help with breaching.
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02-17-2016, 12:18 PM | #20412 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Helicopter Training through Flight Warrant Officer SChool, which would have taken him out of Special Forces altogther and made him a member of the Aviation Branch.
Seriously though as a Special Forces Warrant back in the Early Eighties when the program started, I think they had to first be one of the four, (Med, Weapons, Engineer, Comm) and serve as the Intelligence Sergeant first. Version 2 Flint (Tiger Force) has his SMS as Demolitions. His highest ranking Filecard at CW3. He is definitely on the MFF SFOD-A team though with all the HALO references as well on Subsequent filecards.
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02-17-2016, 01:06 PM | #20413 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,235
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The minimum rank to become an SF WO was E-6, I believe, but you didn't have to be an Intel SGT, although a senior member would have better chances for selection.
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02-17-2016, 02:15 PM | #20414 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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I think you still have to complete the Special Forces Operations and Intelligence Sergeants Course which would qualify you for 18F anyway. Maybe it has changed? Maybe I am confused. I suppose if you took the Intelligence class, and were waiting for your shot at 18F, you could go on to the warrant officer technical and tactical certification course instead.
The first class of 24 SF warrant officers graduated in June 1984. Flint would have been one of the first Graduates. This may explain the E-6 Rank on the filecards.
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. Last edited by Loose Cannon; 02-17-2016 at 02:35 PM.. |
02-17-2016, 04:23 PM | #20415 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,018
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I don't remember seeing that he was a Warrant Officer while in SF - just that he competed the flight WO course.
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02-17-2016, 05:12 PM | #20416 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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I guess it depends on how you interpret the filecard. What is more true to his Character? A pilot or a Special Forces Green Beret (who happens to favor a black beret?) Since a Warrant officer is not E-6 his first filecard has errors.
I suppose one could say he's a jack of all trades, which is how he ended up on the Joes. Still most filecards have him a Warrant officer WO-2, and have him "and finally flight Warrant Officers School." Which seems is were he received his Warrant. This doesn't work for me. So I throw out the Flight Warrant Officer School. Maybe Larry had heard about the new program for Special FOrces Warrant Officers, but wasn't sure how they earned them? So he took what he knew about FLight Warrant Officer SChool and applied it to Flint. Coincidently this would also cause Falcon to need a bump in rank since the whole reason for Special FOrces Warrants was to get rid of the Leiutenants. Not sure when that cutoff was though.
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
02-17-2016, 06:22 PM | #20417 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,018
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Well, the Delta guys wear (or wore) black berets (Badass of the Week: Gary Gordon and Randy Shughart). I see Flint as a Delta operator who, while with Delta, got trained on helos. But he conceivably left the Green Berets as an E-something before becoming a WO-something, and ending up in Joe.
As for Falcon, he needs a bump in rank just through his time in. Who stays an Lt for that long?! |
02-17-2016, 07:59 PM | #20418 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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I wonder if Delta uses Warrant Officers for their teams. I haven't come across a mention of a Warrant Officer.
My theory with Falcon is he should have started out as a Captain.
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02-17-2016, 09:30 PM | #20419 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toxo-Zombie Land
Posts: 1,728
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Quote:
Unfortunately, as LowTech pointed out, there isn't much consistency. Sometimes the specialities are actual MOS but sometimes they represent branches or duty positions or none of the above. It's up to us to interpret the oddities. Take demolitions for instance. Most of us interpret that as combat engineer or SF engineer. If you want to make a distinction you could make the artillery coordinators members of the FDC, but they'd have to be officers to be the FSCOORD.
By the way, does anybody know what that jacked up device is that Lightfoot uses when he is in the field? I think yojoe.com has it listed as a "mine detector unit" or some such nonsense, but it looks more like a mine extractor claw (if that even exists) plus he has a robot "friend." The Impel card says he uses an "airfoil-powered mine detector with a digitized oscillating frequency module and a built-in geiger counter / spectrometer and scintillometer." Is this based on a real EOD tool and backpack? Last edited by seaneley; 02-17-2016 at 09:44 PM.. |
02-18-2016, 08:52 AM | #20420 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: over here
Posts: 2,092
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I disregard the part about Flint being a helicopter pilot and use him as a former Special Forces Warrant Officer. Originally I had him start out as an Infantryman, then Special Forces Weapons Sergeant before moving on to a Special Forces Warrant Officer, however, Loose Cannon brings up an excellent point about his Tiger Force SMS as being "demolitions". So now I am thinking he enlisted as an Infantryman went to SFQC and became a SF Engineer Sergeant, served on a HALO team and then became a SF Warrant Officer.
I agree that maybe he picked up helicopter training on the side and not going into the Warrant Officer Flight School. I hesitate on making him former Delta, though. My take is why would someone go from one Tier 1 organization to another one? Seems more of a lateral move. Of course this is going with the concept that the Joe team is another Tier 1 organization similar to Delta. |
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