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06-13-2011, 03:24 PM | #16431 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,224
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Nice list, Tyroc. Can't wait to see the translations.
So I was looking through the latest Ranger FM and was surprised to see some of the changes. For the most part, they added a fourth Rifle Company to each Battalion and a Support Company. They also broke apart the Weapons Platoon, leaving an Antitank Section and turning the old Mortar Section into a Mortar Platoon assigned to the HHC. The HHC also has a Sniper Platoon of 4 sections of 3 two-man sniper teams and a Recon Platoon of 4 six-man recon teams. But the changes at the platoon level were the most interesting. Instead of a Weapons Squad of 3 three-man machine gun teams, they now have 3 two-man machine gun teams, and the Rifle Squad now consists of seven men instead of the usual nine. Why the downgrade in size? That's 9 less men per platoon, 27 less per company! Was this merely so they could create the fourth company? |
06-13-2011, 11:46 PM | #16432 |
EQ-Viper
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,343
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Quote:
No idea why the reduction in size... although my guess is that they figure it's more appropriate for the type of conflicts the US finds itself involved in these days. |
06-14-2011, 12:16 PM | #16433 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,224
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Quote:
Interesting. Seems a lot like the 7-man infantry squad concept used by the Finnish Defense Forces (where a squad = 1 squad leader and three two-man fire and maneuver teams). Then again, maybe the ranger concept is 1 squad leader and two three-man fireteams.
No idea why the reduction in size... although my guess is that they figure it's more appropriate for the type of conflicts the US finds itself involved in these days. Last edited by Tanksmasher; 06-14-2011 at 12:21 PM.. |
06-15-2011, 04:12 PM | #16434 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,294
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Hey guys, I need some help.
I need to figure out how to "explain" Night Force. My Joeverse concept is basically trying to incorporate all vehicles / figures made but trying to make it as "real world" as possible. I know that alot of Tankers use Night Force as either a delta equivalent or as a SWAT / SRT type of force. I originally envisioned Night Force as the Special Activities side of the Joes but the vehicles it comes with make it impossible. NF vehicles are; Night Blaster (Artillery) Night Raider (Armor) Night Storm (Mobile Gun System-armor) NF Grizzly (Armor) Night Striker (Hovercraft) Night Ray (Hydrocraft) Night Rhino (Amphibious Assault) Night Shade / Spectre (Submarine) Night Scrambler (Amphibious Personnel Carrier) Night Boomer (Fixed Wing) There seems to be a huge emphasis on Amphibious type vehicles and armor, so therefore, I've switched tact and am now trying to reinvent it as a coastal amphibious force instead. My question is; Does a coastal amphibious force relate readily to anti piracy or maritime interdiction operations? Any feedback would be most helpful Thanks |
06-15-2011, 04:22 PM | #16435 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,294
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Btw, Tanksmasher. I came across this earlier today and thought it might be of interest to your Vietnam Joe project..
In an AF annual, there's a prose story that deals with Gung Ho's time in 'Nam where he served with Leatherneck, Wild Bill and interestingly Roadblock. Action Force Annual 1990 - G.I. Joe Wiki - Joepedia - GI Joe, Cobra, toys and Vietnam War - G.I. Joe Wiki - Joepedia - GI Joe, Cobra, toys |
06-15-2011, 04:54 PM | #16436 |
EQ-Viper
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,343
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Sure. Most of the joint anti-piracy and maritime interdiction operations being conducted off of the East African coast are performed by NATO and PfP Navy, Coast Guard, and Marine/Naval Infantry units, all of which have some degree of amphibious capabilities. I don't know if Night Force is that team, though. Is Cutter on the Night Force roster (Night Force was after I stopped buying ARAH, so I'm not really familiar with them)? Because I think he'd be the best choice to lead a GI Joe anti-piracy team (It would be a bit of a waste of his other talents and skills to use a SEAL like Torpedo for purely a maritime interdiction role).
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06-15-2011, 07:59 PM | #16437 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,224
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Thanks, Tyroc. Interesting. I didn't know about the Action Force story.
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06-15-2011, 10:13 PM | #16438 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Gung-Ho's Vietnam service has never been mentioned to the best of my knowledge. I just assumed he served specially due to his rank in 1983. But that is no guarantee. I miss Gung-Ho. I was hoping the Rock would have played Gung-Ho in the GIJOE 2. Speaking of Marines. Maybe the Night FOrce guys could be more of a Marine FAST team.
__________________
Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
06-16-2011, 10:06 AM | #16439 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,586
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Quote:
The manual also says that a platoon can be split into two sections so that the Regiment can amass forces. They didn't give a breakdown of the squad, so I don't know if there's a SL (SSG) leading a squad of six enlisted men minus two Team Leaders (SGT) or if there's still two fire teams with two TL but no Riflemen. I'd imagine they'd keep the extra NCOs but who knows. But I suppose it could be something where there's a TL (SSG), ATL (SGT), 2 SAWs, 2 Grenadiers and 1 Rifleman as well.
I remember in the Norwegian "Storm" (mechinf), we officially had two 7 man heavy squads, each comprising an MG and an AT fireteam; plus two 8 man heavy squads, each the same as above but adding a designated marksman (DM). And let me tell you, four MG 3s, four Carl Gustav 84mms or Eryx wireguided ATGMs, a pair of scoped rifles, plus a bunch more basic rifles and few grenade launchers is a lot of firepower for 32 guys. And then you have all the weapons on the IFVs of course. But I digress... But in the field we experimented with all kinds of things, like three basic 8 man heavy squads and one 4 man "scout team" including both DMs functioning more like snipers. Or three basic heavy squads and a smaller command squad centered around the platoon leader. Bear in mind too, that at any give time (even in peacetime) a platoon is often understrength. So whatever it says in the rulebook is really just a guide. The infantry will always improvise. |
06-16-2011, 10:00 PM | #16440 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,224
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That's cool, Stormgard. I didn't know you served in the Mech Inf. Is that where the name comes from?
Yeah, most of the time, units are improvising and simply reworking what they have to work with, but I'm always interested in the base structure or standard TO&E. Units are often understrength as you pointed out and you can build whatever size team you really need. I was just surprised to see them reduce the rifle squad to 7. Reducing the MG teams to 2 instead of 3 makes sense if that's all it takes to handle the weapon effectively, but reducing the rifle squad makes it seem like all they did was downsize the standard size of the platoon. There are obvious times when you have to operate with less than standard because of transportation limitations, and so, but I was just curious as to why they thought the smaller unit would be more effective. Makes sense for missions that require stealth and covert entry like recon, since more men can give away a position, but Rangers often seem to function more as a direct action element. I don't know. Do you think they've kept the original 3 NCOs in the squad? Seems like it might be overkill--3 SGTs leading 4 SPC/PFCs. Plus I imagine that would effect recruitment, requiring more NCOs for less people per squad. I'm guessing they're using 1 SL, 1 TL, 2 SAWs (MK46s), 2 Grenadiers and 1 rifleman, which still allows room for two effective fireteams. |
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