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05-19-2010, 04:04 PM | #13401 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: May 2007
Location: England
Posts: 1,230
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As a random-ish aside, and you guys have probably been through this already, are SE's shoulder patches in Marvel issue #108 real ones? And if so, what do they signify?
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05-19-2010, 04:58 PM | #13402 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Quote:
As that titbit is in the original Marvel comic run (and therefore canon), it'll need to be added to whatever backgrounds we've got for those guys of course. I'm happy that it does allow us to lay to rest the fact that Stalker is imo a Green Beret at the time he meets SE & SS in Vietnam. Thoughts? Well it doesn't really confirm anything, as there were many units that participated in MACV. But it certainly helps make the case for those 3 being SF. Does it say MACV or MACV-SOG as that would make a bigger difference?
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
05-19-2010, 09:34 PM | #13403 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
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Well SE was definitely SOG so that's why I consider him a Green Beret, but Stalker is uncertain. They run recon together but perhaps SE just joins up with a LRP unit, which in reality would have been odd, I suppose, but in my joeverse Stalker is a Green Beret.
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05-19-2010, 09:40 PM | #13404 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
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Quote:
Agreed, if he had worn one of those it would solve lots of problems ;)
Hmm, I do wish we had a wiki so I could see the reasoning behind the 101st Airbourne connection. So what are you thinking, he was not supposed to be a Green Beret and should have had a camo beret rather than green? At what point was the green beret adopted by the Special Forces? Before Vietnam? Could it just be that he has a green beret but is not a Green Beret (tenuous I know)? And he also wore the green beret in Vietnam, so if we're going with the theory that he's Special Forces, he must have been with them then (i.e. before the Joes, etc.) |
05-19-2010, 09:43 PM | #13405 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
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I have some sources of Green Berets working in LRP units. In fact there's a decent book calling Going Native where a SF medic gets transferred to another unit b/c he didn't have the experience and confidence he needed to perform with his SF unit, and so he ended up working with LRPs before returning to his old SF unit.
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"We make a stand now or there will be nobody left to go to the choppa!" --Major Alan "Dutch" Schaefer Last edited by Tanksmasher; 05-19-2010 at 09:56 PM.. |
05-19-2010, 09:49 PM | #13406 |
Hog Driver
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 12,236
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Quote:
I think once you go Special Forces (Green Beret) you don't go back, unless injured. Or like what Oliver has mentioned, they go to 4th Psy-Ops for a spell and then rotate back in with the unit. But 4th Psy-Ops is a Special Ops unit as well. (Probably because it's full of older Experienced Green Berets)
But I think if you were a Green Beret in Vietnam you were a Green Beret. You trained the LRRPs. The Recondo School in Nha Trang was run by the Green Berets. And everyone wanted to send guys there, just so they could be trained by Green Berets. This was before there was a Ranger School, or even Rangers. But even Marines went there, (Like Gung-Ho). But it's totally possible that Stalker went later, but while he was a LRRP I don't think he was a Green Beret. Because that would have been higher status. Sure the Green Berets performed Long Range missions, with their MIKE forces, but I'm sure they wouldn't call themselves LRRPs. And there was a Ranger School during Vietnam but no Ranger units until '69 as you pointed out.
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"We make a stand now or there will be nobody left to go to the choppa!" --Major Alan "Dutch" Schaefer Last edited by Tanksmasher; 05-19-2010 at 09:57 PM.. |
05-20-2010, 12:08 AM | #13407 |
80's Civil Air Patrol Cdt
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Wichita, The Air Capital of the World
Posts: 678
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So I went to Biglots today and I picked up Airborne, the 'bazooka' anti-armor cobra trooper and Cobra infiltration Flint. Since the Infiltration Flint looks to have fairer skin of the three I own, he will be the head of Major Sykes "TRILITH", with the 25th shotgun shell harness. Im still unsure which body I plan to use to keep him distinct in appearance. Im kinda hoping to find an ROC Reactive suit Duke for his body.
Im planning to talk myself out of buying the Resolute 7 pack since I only 'really' want Stalker in that set now. Now, that I found my Action Force 'Flint'. I can save around 60 dollars with shipping.
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Cobra's got the Delta Station, They're plantin' cubes throughout creation. If we don't start RETALIATION, We're sunk and that's no bunk. -Roadblock, in Pyramid of Darkness miniseries. |
05-20-2010, 12:26 AM | #13408 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Quote:
I don't have any comics with me to go back and look through. And htmlcomics doesn't seem to be up any more. Yeah but SOG is SOG. What Other Army units work as part of SOG besides SF? There is also some instances of other units being tasked to work with SOG. Quote:
Well if we look at the original card art for Stalker--assuming this was what the designer/artist intended, even though the actual figure has a solid green beret as does the comic character--you'll notice that Stalker is actually wearing a tiger-striped beret, which WAS worn by LRPs. So the green beret, I believe, was just an accident or mistake on the manufacturer's part and the comic just imitated the look of the actual figure. This is a reasonable explanation, I think.
That's what I believe happened. I think even the prototype figures had him with the camo beret. Quote:
I have some sources of Green Berets working in LRP units. In fact there's a decent book calling Going Native where a SF medic gets transferred to another unit b/c he didn't have the experience and confidence he needed to perform with his SF unit, and so he ended up working with LRPs before returning to his old SF unit.
Right this is my only problem with Stalker being SF in Vietnam. SF guys didn't usually work with LRP units. They did plenty of deep recon missons, but they were SF and they did lots of other things. Quote:
The Green Berets didn't typically train LRPs. The bulk of them were trained OTJ in Vietnam with their unit. SF ran the Recondo School, but not all LRPs got to go there. Only a small percent of them went b/c the school had limited slots and was quite competitive and was open to other units like Marines, SEAL and Korean units. And ones that did go often went after they had already been running LRP missions, so they were already experienced LRPs.
And there was a Ranger School during Vietnam but no Ranger units until '69 as you pointed out. You're right. I don't know why I put that down. There was the 8 week Ranger School, just no Rangers yet. There is nothing that says any Joes went to Recondo School in Nha Trang. (Although I wonder about Gung-Ho and Recondo) I wonder what percentage of the SOG operatives went or had to go to Recondo school. Only like 3400 guys graduated from Recondo School. Hey Tanksmasher I figure you would know about it more than anyone else, went they formed the Ranger units in 69, they folded in the LRRP units? But I guess they just kept the units as independent companies with the units they came out of? Were those newly formed Ranger Units part of SOG then? I was just reading a book about the Mobile Strike Forces (MIKE) in Vietnam. Mostly just an overview of events, unit structure and actions they participated in. I was looking for Stalker in a camo beret, when I looked at the old catalog. It's funny originally they were referred to as "Mobile Strike Force Team" YOJOE.COM | Catalog Gallery - 1982
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
05-20-2010, 12:33 AM | #13409 |
W.O.R.M.S. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Back in the US of A! (NoVA)
Posts: 10,649
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Quote:
So I went to Biglots today and I picked up Airborne, the 'bazooka' anti-armor cobra trooper and Cobra infiltration Flint. Since the Infiltration Flint looks to have fairer skin of the three I own, he will be the head of Major Sykes "TRILITH", with the 25th shotgun shell harness. Im still unsure which body I plan to use to keep him distinct in appearance. Im kinda hoping to find an ROC Reactive suit Duke for his body.
Im planning to talk myself out of buying the Resolute 7 pack since I only 'really' want Stalker in that set now. Now, that I found my Action Force 'Flint'. I can save around 60 dollars with shipping. The 5-pack Flint is good enough. (ALthough Resolute looks great) Beachhead doesn't look better than 25th or the POC that is coming out. Scarlett=meh. Roadblock=Walmart Roadblock Duke I'm not crazy about SE is the same as city strike Stalker looks good as Quick Stryke (Extreme) & maybe the only reason I'm buying the set.
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Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome. |
05-20-2010, 02:51 AM | #13410 |
Crimson Guard
Join Date: May 2007
Location: England
Posts: 1,230
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Well if we look at the original card art for Stalker--assuming this was what the designer/artist intended, even though the actual figure has a solid green beret as does the comic character--you'll notice that Stalker is actually wearing a tiger-striped beret, which WAS worn by LRPs. So the green beret, I believe, was just an accident or mistake on the manufacturer's part and the comic just imitated the look of the actual figure. This is a reasonable explanation, I think.
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