Picture of the New Packaging for Retaliation Toys

[Crazy Legs]

So, if a few of us write to Hasbro saying that our kid just shot themselves in the eye with the huge missile launcher, will they stop making them?

P.S. the packaging sucks

Nah, you have to get local news to make a report. Getting stuff on TV really gets stuff riled up.
So you better teach your kid to lie good cause it would suck if this ends up like that dude that was lying about his kid flying away in a weather balloon.

[Dem_Yoe'z!]

They only need to bring back the "weapons trees" and they'll have recreated everything that killed the line back in 1994.

[sewnback2gether]

That duke figure is a waste of plastic. The missle launcher too, I would take ankle articulation over some of these crappy figs anyday.

[CrimsonGuard101]

That duke figure is a waste of plastic. The middle launcher too, I would take ankle articulation over some of these crappy figs anyday.

It will return after they pay back Paramount for the license costs to use the likness of the Rock and Bruce Willis like when they dumped the actor liknesses for ROC and we got the awesomeness of POC..those 2 actors are the whole reason Hasbro was forced to go into this articualtion/packaging economic downturn....hopefuly they can recover from that...

[gunslingercbr]

Nothing learned from history. What killed the Joe line in the 90s? big bright weapons, and too much focus on ninjas. The package art looks like the wwe wrestling figure art, Hasbro is trying to grab the wwe fans because the Rock is in the movie.
I was looking forward to the movie & the toy line, but now I just want it to be over so we can get back to good Joe stuff.

that simply isn't true at all. what killed the line in the 90's was that the generation of kids that made it popular in the 80's outgrew it, and the generation of kids in the 90's were more interested in new toy brands like TMNT.

fact is, the changes you mentioned did not cause the decline, they were a response to existing decline to try to appeal to what the new generation of kids in the 90's preferred.

[Griffin73]

That Duke figure is terrible. Sadly, I actually hope they kill Duke off in the movie.
Really, I shouldn't feel this way about this beloved character but I do. I can't stand Channing Tater and his ugly mug. I was really hoping they'd recast him with someone that can act their way out of a paper bag.

[Troynos]

Why would they recast Tatum? He's a marketable star in Hollywood.

It's not like they cast the Rock for his great acting talent.

The more stars in Retaliation, the better, as it'll attract more movie goers and the film will do better.

And hopefully some of that spills over into the toyline.

[Trazz]

With Real dying Action!!!!

[THALASTDRAGON]

That looks terrible. The figure and the packaging. I saw an image of Duke's figure the other day and wow, everything about it was just awful. That missile launcher looked like something that should be attached to a vehicle. It was huge.

Death of the line!!!
I haven't read that line on here in a while. I love it haha.

[Pit Viper]

Looks like he took the missile launcher off the Battle Wagon.

[jmlawn]

and that made hasbro produce crap, when you follow a market trend instead of lead the market trend, you fail. TMNT was popular so hasbro made more ninjas & flashy guns,bright costumes, & vehicles that looked more like they were from TMNT than GIJOE.
Look at the GIJOE product in 84 & compare it to the crap produced in 92-94. 82-86 was more military than anything else they made,

[Troynos]

and that made hasbro produce crap, when you follow a market trend instead of lead the market trend, you fail. TMNT was popular so hasbro made more ninjas & flashy guns,bright costumes, & vehicles that looked more like they were from TMNT than GIJOE.
Look at the GIJOE product in 84 & compare it to the crap produced in 92-94. 82-86 was more military than anything else they made,

And that theme ran it's course, meaning they had to go somewhere else to for Joe to keep selling.

You can attempt to lead the market trend all you want, but if your sales decline, you have to do what you can to keep those sales and that usually means jumping on the bandwagon.

[Gyre-Viper]

Nothing learned from history. What killed the Joe line in the 90s? big bright weapons, and too much focus on ninjas. The package art looks like the wwe wrestling figure art, Hasbro is trying to grab the wwe fans because the Rock is in the movie.
I was looking forward to the movie & the toy line, but now I just want it to be over so we can get back to good Joe stuff.


That is simply not true. Not only has Kirk Bozigian held panels on the subject numerous times at con... but you can actually hear him reiterate it here... why the 90's were actually successful etc...

Flag Points » Blog Archive » Flag Points #20 Kirk Bozigian (http://flagpoints.podbean.com/2012/03/18/flag-points-20-kirk-bozigian/)

[Troynos]

The package art looks like the wwe wrestling figure art, Hasbro is trying to grab the wwe fans because the Rock is in the movie.

And that's wrong how?

[Gyre-Viper]

and that made hasbro produce crap, when you follow a market trend instead of lead the market trend, you fail. TMNT was popular so hasbro made more ninjas & flashy guns,bright costumes, & vehicles that looked more like they were from TMNT than GIJOE.
Look at the GIJOE product in 84 & compare it to the crap produced in 92-94. 82-86 was more military than anything else they made,

Yeah but they weren't making money doing that. The 90's stuff brought profit back to the Joe line. They just couldn't find a way to keep that going with also trying new ideas while also competing with everything from Power Rangers to even competing with themselves ie Kenner etc. I'm not saying mistakes weren't made... I'm saying that blaming it on neon and big guns and motorized bits isn't the black and white of it... not even close.

[gunslingercbr]

You don't know the particulars of their contract so what you say may be true and it may not be. Where Lucas pioneered the intellectual property income through star wars toys, the source of this property comes from the Hasbro themselves. I doubt they said to Paramount, you pay us money for the rights to our movie and we'll pay you for the rights to sell toys from the property we've just sold you the rights to. I'd guess paramount gets nothing from the toy sales. The actors are paid for the use of their likenesses which may be built into their original contracts and may not be. The use of the paramount movie name "Retaliation" is probably built in as a term of the contract.
unfortunately, you are wrong on all accounts.

it has already been widely reported that the Paramount gets licensing fees from Hasbro for every toy sold for both Transformers and G.I. Joe movies.

here is an article on Transformers, and it is the same deal they have for G.I. Joe; :

The Incestuous Payday Behind Transformers (http://io9.com/5310350/the-incestuous-payday-behind-transformers)

and just to make sure there is no confusion, here is the key part that states exactly what I said:

Dreamworks/Paramount, of course, have to pay Hasbro a license fee to use the Transformers brand and characters in the first place, but in turn, Hasbro has to give up money on movie-related merchandise;

there are actually other articles online back in 2009 with more specifics but I can't seem to find them.

EDIT: Here is another:
http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/jun2009/db20090611_333306_page_2.htm

But that doesn't mean Hasbro gets an entirely free ride. It must share some royalties for toys based on the movie with the studio and Bay.
Now they are not only paying Paramount, they are paying Bay directly for Transformers toys as well.

just think about it for a second. Paramount spends far much more money making the movies than Hasbro does making the toys. Paramount spends the money to create the movie, its imagery, designs, etc. Hasbro may own the brand, but why would Paramount spend all that money just to give what they created to Hasbro.

Hasbro benefits as much, if not more, by Paramount making the movies than Paramount does by making them because of how much money it costs to make them. Hasbro isn't pumping $400 million into Transformers with every movie, but that is how much it costs to make and market the movies. Paramount is the one taking the largest risk. of course they are going to demand payment for the elements they create to do so.

additionally, the actors don't sign contracts with Hasbro, they sign them with Paramount who has hired them for the movie and assumes the right to license their likeness out for consumer products as part of their contracts. actors likeness is no different than using the movie design for Optimus Prime, it is something that belongs to the movie and Hasbro pays to Paramount to use to leverage the movie to sell toys.

[Pit Viper]

that simply isn't true at all. what killed the line in the 90's was that the generation of kids that made it popular in the 80's outgrew it, and the generation of kids in the 90's were more interested in new toy brands like TMNT.

fact is, the changes you mentioned did not cause the decline, they were a response to existing decline to try to appeal to what the new generation of kids in the 90's preferred.

With that said I think if Hasbro would of stuck with a more military design the line would have lasted longer. What they did was made G.I. Joe into a knock-off of TMNT or Power Rangers which didn't really appeal to anybody. While it is true that we were growing up it is not as if kids who were interested in toy soldiers suddenly died off in the catastrophic event. While we grew out of it . . well OK maybe not you or I but while many of our generation grew out of it there were other younger kids who were interested in toy soldiers and nobody was offering them.

Sgt. Savage was a turn in the right direction IMO it was just done with an idiotic new scale and style of construction. Imagine how much those figures would be going for today on Ebay if they were RAH style?

[Gyre-Viper]

You don't know the particulars of their contract so what you say may be true and it may not be. Where Lucas pioneered the intellectual property income through star wars toys, the source of this property comes from the Hasbro themselves. I doubt they said to Paramount, you pay us money for the rights to our movie and we'll pay you for the rights to sell toys from the property we've just sold you the rights to. I'd guess paramount gets nothing from the toy sales. The actors are paid for the use of their likenesses which may be built into their original contracts and may not be. The use of the paramount movie name "Retaliation" is probably built in as a term of the contract.


Paramount from what I think I've understood thus far, has a lot more influence than most people give it credit for. Like actual control etc.
And stakes in everything. So I gotta disagree.

[Gyre-Viper]

With that said I think if Hasbro would of stuck with a more military design the line would have lasted longer. What they did was made G.I. Joe into a knock-off of TMNT or Power Rangers which didn't really appeal to anybody. While it is true that we were growing up it is not as if kids who were interested in toy soldiers suddenly died off in the catastrophic event. While we grew out of it . . well OK maybe not you or I but while many of our generation grew out of it there were other younger kids who were interested in toy soldiers and nobody was offering them.

Sgt. Savage was a turn in the right direction IMO it was just done with an idiotic new scale and style of construction. Imagine how much those figures would be going for today on Ebay if they were RAH style?


Well part of the idea with Savage was to beef up the troops. Make them
playable alongside the competition. Kids like to mix their toys up and the 3 3/4 Joe just didn't mesh well with the brawn of other toys.

[gunslingercbr]

With that said I think if Hasbro would of stuck with a more military design the line would have lasted longer. What they did was made G.I. Joe into a knock-off of TMNT or Power Rangers which didn't really appeal to anybody. While it is true that we were growing up it is not as if kids who were interested in toy soldiers suddenly died off in the catastrophic event. While we grew out of it . . well OK maybe not you or I but while many of our generation grew out of it there were other younger kids who were interested in toy soldiers and nobody was offering them.

Sgt. Savage was a turn in the right direction IMO it was just done with an idiotic new scale and style of construction. Imagine how much those figures would be going for today on Ebay if they were RAH style?
that may be so but it is pure speculation. kids in the 90's were interested in different things than kids in the 80's. there is no indication that a military toy would have appealed to them.

but we have seen that a military toy has failed to capture kids imaginations since then, so it is more reasonable to assume that a military themed Joe wouldn't have worked at that RAH may very well have been the perfect product created at the perfect time to succeed in the 80's, and the brand has failed since then to succeed because it hasn't created another identity that resonates with modern consumers the way RAH did in the 80's. but that doesn't mean that what worked in the 80's will still work today.

[jmlawn]

The reason the 25th line did so well was because it used all the original core sellers from 82-87 before all the flashy ninja crap figures. They could keep that going all day there are plenty of figures I would love to get from the late 80s & early 90s done in 25th style. Why does Star Wars continue to sell? because they don't try to reboot the line every 5 years, they add to it. When you try to reboot the stories that came before, you ruin the integrity of the characters.

[ultramax]

Fail

[Troynos]

Why does Star Wars continue to sell? because they don't try to reboot the line every 5 years, they add to it. When you try to reboot the stories that came before, you ruin the integrity of the characters.

Ruin it to who? The fans that stopped buying which led to the decline in sales?


Star Wars has been getting reboots, not fullscale mythos changes, but there have been reboots.

And because there haven't been fullscale reboots, they have to keep mining the same characters over and over and over and over and over or go for the really obscure ones.



The reason Joe gets rebooted is because it doesn't sell. If the concept on the market isn't selling, you introduce a new concept and try to get that one to sell. If that doesn't sell, then you introduce a new one, and so on and so on until something clicks.


Do we have to like it? No. But that's the reality of the situation.




And the 25th line didn't do that well. It started off as small quantities, those sold well, but when they started to produce in higher numbers, it wasn't selling out anymore.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Yeah I hope he is gone after this one and Cotrona does a good job playing Flint. Flint can carry the flag while they play Tapps for Tatem...Tatem dosent wanna do this gig anyway...like he said about ROC...I guess they threw enough money at hime to keep him interested





And the 25th line didn't do that well. It started off as small quantities, those sold well, but when they started to produce in higher numbers, it wasn't selling out anymore.

Yeah because the market already had its fill of the revision cases very quickly...that over saturated the line before waves 10-13 could surface properly...had it been new characters like the later waves did EBFORE ROC hit they would still be selling to this day vs. the huge hindrance ROC put on the passage to POC and the 30th...

[gunslingercbr]

The reason the 25th line did so well was because it used all the original core sellers from 82-87 before all the flashy ninja crap figures. They could keep that going all day there are plenty of figures I would love to get from the late 80s & early 90s done in 25th style. Why does Star Wars continue to sell? because they don't try to reboot the line every 5 years, they add to it. When you try to reboot the stories that came before, you ruin the integrity of the characters.
you don't ruin anything with reboots. Star Wars succeeds for far more reasons than just continuity.

Transformers reboots every few years and has been massively successful, so there goes your assertion. that is why you can't just point to one example and try to make an argument, because you are likely ignoring plenty of others that dispute it.

[Cerebral Dissolution]

AWESOME DUKE COMES WITH A QUAD BLASTER!!!



What garbage.

[Troynos]

Yeah I hope he is gone after this one and Cotrona does a good job playing Flint. Flint can carry the flag while they play Tapps for Tatem...Tatem dosent wanna do this gig anyway...like he said about ROC...I guess they threw enough money at hime to keep him interested

If I remember right, all the actors were contracted for 3 movies. The others got released from their contractors, Tatum (the only marketable one out of all of them, except for the guy that plays Storm Shadow who is very popular over in his neck of the woods) didn't.

And I bet if the Rock hadn't been involved, he might have tried to get out of it. But then again, he's only in it for a little bit (I'm thinking the first 15 mins, the opening scene, since we've seen him on the Howler and on the ground and in pictures of a fight with Lady Jaye), so probably not. Just took the money and ran.

And I'm hoping I'm wrong, but it looks like Flint isn't getting a leadership role in the movie. He looks more like the sidekick (similar to Wayans in RoC) to Roadblock.




Yeah because the market already ha dits fill of the revision cases very quickly...

Couple things on this. The revision cases happened because there wasn't enough product planned. The 25th was never meant to get as big as it did.

And the later waves, the more heavily produced, didn't sell as much.

[Blot]

Ah. So we're getting a Ripcord with Duke...


Waitaminute! RIPCORD IS ORANGE?

[jmlawn]

But those characters continue to sell. If I was just getting into gijoe arah now, and tried to follow back to its begining, I'd be like wtf? I say that now reading the comics!
Funny thing is I don't collect star wars but I'm jealous of it's consistency.

[CrimsonGuard101]

And the later waves, the more heavily produced, didn't sell as much.

Becaase they were not supported by retail in regards to proper stocking proceedures. I remeber wave 10 real well...the clear wraithgate having to hit small food stores to find the rpoduct and the waves that hit again around christmas time right before we swicthed to the movie toys that later year. Stores were stocked full of revisions from 7,8,9 for so long they didnt bother pulling in waves 10-13 and what caused 14 to be cancelled as well as Resolutes unfinished characters and other comic packs that retail chose not to support into cancellation. This is where Joe started it downard spiral at retail form which is still has never recovered and furthered into that abyss by ROC. The 30th even got screwed by Retaliation product in a very similar fashion along with terrible retail support of POC and the 30th.

You cant just say it didnt do well, maybe thats your perosanl opinon but not fact, in fact none of the lines since 2007 have done "well" but did good enough to keep the toys on the shelf apparenlty...if the movies didnt force a brand reboot every other year since ROC, and we could have had one full figure line from 2007 -2012 we would have 5 years to refelct on Joes success...but no such luck...the reboots are happening becuase they want them too, they are looking for the magical configuration to make it as successful as transformers, completely ingoring the fact that it will take a total cross over/merger to get that done. Which I hope they decide to do soon. It would be epic to have NEST replaced by the Joes...

[Troynos]

But those characters continue to sell.

No they don't. That's why it keeps getting rebooted, redone, re-whatever you want to call it.

If they sold at the levels they need to, then we'd still have G.I. Joe ARAH.

ARAH would be easy to trace back to it's beginnings. Vintage and anything from 2007 to 2009, just before RoC.

[Troynos]

If the movie never happened would we still have ARAH packaged Joe?

Doubtful.



Stocking is a catch-22 in many ways. There is no perfect way of doing it.

You want product on the shelves, want new product at all times. That's why they release so many waves in a single year.

But if something sells out before a new wave, you need new product, so you get a revision case. Then you have to hope that the interest is there to sell out that revision case before the new wave hits.

And the process keeps repeating itself.


The market wasn't there to support the revision cases.

[gunslingercbr]

And the 25th line didn't do that well. It started off as small quantities, those sold well, but when they started to produce in higher numbers, it wasn't selling out anymore.

it is truly amazing how people continue to make these claims about how well the 25th line did because it reveals they are actually just making it up with no tangible argument in their favor othe rthan they liked it so it must have been a hit.

here is Hasbro's own words about the Joe brand in 2009:
In fact, this year we expect revenues in excess of $100 million for G.I. Joe, which is over three times bigger than it was last year.
Hasbro Q3 2009 Earnings Call Transcript - Seeking Alpha (http://seekingalpha.com/article/167333-hasbro-q3-2009-earnings-call-transcript)

so, if $100 million in revenues in 2009 is over three times higher than revenues in 2008, which was when the 25th line actually saw increased production and distribution, that means at its best the 25th line was a $33 million dollar brand.

compare that to Transformers, which was $350 million in 2008, and you see how little the brand was, and thus how minimal its success was.

that's not to say the brand did nothing. it had a tremendous amount of retail support and we got a lot of product, but it was 1/10 of what Transformers was. while nobody can expect every toyline to be as massive a hit as Transformers, it does reveal how large of a market there is for toys and only capturing 1/10th of the market reveals a significant lack of interest in the market, which is not a huge success.

[Dragasses]

That thing is terrible. Both the figure and packaging look like crap. Oh how I miss RoC...
still applies.

[Deftones1982]

ROC art/packing was much better then what we get now. I won't buy that many figures of the new line.

[jmlawn]

I said Now, Not 5 years ago in the last reboot, and anytime I get my hands on 25th figures They move, i'm a retailer, and the 25th line always sold out, I moved tons of it. The dvd packs any vehicles all the figures. The hardest thing to get my hands on now is the 30th line, all they seem to want to ship is the renegades line. I remember in the 80s & 90s the stores were stocked with joe figures & vehicles. you need good product to move a line, if you had good vehicles to go with the figures, they would sell more. Hasbro used to market figures & vehicles with the right balance so that one sold the other. Now they've been rehashing the same Vamp & Hiss for almost 3 toy lines & thats all they offer.
That will not move a line. They forgot how to market this product, even though they still have the tools in place, they're just not using them.

[Troynos]

Forgetting that the 30th and Pursuit of Cobra are essentially filler lines. Of course it's going to be mostly rehashes.

They have the movie line to work on.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Forgetting that the 30th and Pursuit of Cobra are essentially filler lines. Of course it's going to be mostly rehashes.

They have the movie line to work on.

Not so much. the 30th was supposed to be another 25th anniversary for the fans. Not just a "filler" line. No doubt the movie derailed it and caused it to be reduced from the number of figures they wanted to do for it (and add in the non-30th characters from Reneagdes) also the fact hey had to start it ealier then they wanted to (terrible and botched transition from POC)...same for POC...they wanted to make due on the crap they gave us from ROC...they knew they messed up and wanted to rectify that...but of course all of those people that cared about all of that are not with Hasbro anymore and were replaced with the new people at the helm that feel this is the direction they want to go with paramount holding the steering wheel. We will see how well the retalaition filler movie figures do, that will speak volumes to whats next after 2012.

[Gyre-Viper]

Not so much. the 30th was supposed to be another 25th anniversary for the fans. Not just a "filler" line. No doubt the movie derailed it and caused it to be reduced from the number of figures they wanted to do for it (and add in the non-30th characters from Reneagdes) also the fact hey had to start it ealier then they wanted to (terrible and botched transition from POC)...same for POC...they wanted to make due on the crap they gave us from ROC...they knew they messed up and wanted to rectify that...but of course all of those people that cared about all of that are not with Hasbro anymore and were replaced with the new people at the helm that feel this is the direction they want to go with paramount holding the steering wheel. We will see how well the retalaition filler movie figures do, that will speak volumes to whats next after 2012.


Well the 25th line originally was supposed to be limited. And the 30th was supposed to go until the film and then the film got pulled forward.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Well the 25th line originally was supposed to be limited. And the 30th was supposed to go until the film and then the film got pulled forward.

Yeah, somehting triggered the need to increase and expunge the 25th beyond what it was meant to be, but again thrwated by a movie...and yes...Retaliation again thwarts another celebratory year...I hope nothign gets in the way of the 35th and 40th...but I am sure they have plenty to derail those celebrations as well...if Joe makes it that far...

[Troynos]

PoC was supposed to be the continuation of the RoC line and not a seperate line.

The last couple waves of RoC (city strike) was the start of PoC.

And that was originally going to run from RoC to sequel.

They threw the 30th into the mix as a "thank you" to us.

[CVdelgado]

i love the whole quadruple missile launcher. its a clear message to tankers. we heard you, but these toys are NOT made for you. so we are quadrupling down on the missile launchers.

[Troynos]

Yeah, somehting triggered the need to increase and expunge the 25th beyond what it was meant to be, but again thrwated by a movie

The movie was always going to happen. Nothing got thwarted by RoC.

The 25th sold good enough, thanks to us, that Hasbro and the retailers thought they could keep it going until the movie.

It was never meant to go beyond the movie line.

[CrimsonGuard101]

PoC was supposed to be the continuation of the RoC line and not a seperate line.

The last couple waves of RoC (city strike) was the start of PoC.

And that was originally going to run from RoC to sequel.

They threw the 30th into the mix as a "thank you" to us.

I wouldnt go as far as to say continuation, but more of a segway into a different direction. Once they dumped the actor likenesses all connection to ROC was severed. They even dumped the nanomite/turdle vipers idea at that point woth the City Strike Snake Eyes wave. Wayanes barley made into that mix.

And if these lines have been doing so horrible why would they give us a "thank you" line? lol thats absurd...


It was never meant to go beyond the movie line.

Cept it did, it manifested into almost all of the later waves of POC and the entire 30th line (minus the obligatory Renegades figure slot fillers) Remeber POC had 25th stands not ROC stands.

[Troynos]

I wouldnt go as far as to say continuation, but more of a segway into a different direction. Once they dumped the actor likenesses all connection to ROC was severed. They even dumped the nanomite/turdle vipers idea at that point woth the City Strike Snake Eyes wave. Wayanes barley made into that mix.

And if these lines have been doing so horrible why would they give us a "thank you" line? lol thats absurd...



Cept it did, it manifested into almost all of the later waves of POC and the entire 30th line (minus the obligatory Renegades figure slot fillers) Remeber POC had 25th stands not ROC stands.

Why wouldn't they give us a "thank you" line at an anniversary?

1- to actually thank the fans
2- keep the Joe brand on the shelves (attempt to, what the retailers actually do is something that Hasbro doesn't control)


Having the ARAH likenesses doesn't make it the ARAH line. Those are thrown in there for long time fans, easter egg kind of things.


And yes, PoC was meant as a continuation. After RoC's issues, they retooled it into a new line, and got rid of the likenesses, to make it stand out from RoC, but the intent was always to continue the RoC story through PoC.

[CrimsonGuard101]

And yes, PoC was meant as a continuation. After RoC's issues, they retooled it into a new line, and got rid of the likenesses, to make it stand out from RoC, but the intent was always to continue the RoC story through PoC.

4 themed areas of conflict on the globe, vehicles and characters that were not even protrayted in the film (esecpially the cobra vipers/troopers/jungle vipers/shock troopers), dropping of the Reactive impact armor and AC6 suits, no nanomites to be found, concepts of cobra vehicles slowly evolving to become better (which never came to fution due to another change, cough retaliation). None of those themes were laid out in ROC. If this had been a continuation of POC we woul dhave seen more Scarlet, RIS, AC6 more akin to what we saw from the GI JOE ROC video game and Operation HISS which they distance from very quickly. I can only wish ROC had been influnced by such cool ideas POC had...its was like night and day different.

[Troynos]

Take off Beachhead's tact vest. That's Reactive armor under there.

Desert Battle Heavy Duty: Reactive Armor

City Strike Scarlett was canceled.

Jungle Assault Ripcord, City Strike Duke, Jungle Assault Duke (original one had a Tatum head) = all have reactive impact armor on.

Jungle Assault Cobra Commander = RoC CC

PoC was originally meant to be a continuation of RoC to transition the line until the sequel.

[DARKWIND]

I think when its all said and done . . .
-It will still be a pain to find any of these at retail.
-People will hem and haw but the product will still move when the movie debuts (and even before).
-The scalpers will still dropkick kids to get product to sell online.
-As soon as fans/customizers start to use the parts for customs it will drive prices higher. (Which I'm not knocking its just how its looks to go.)
-The figs from this line I do want (armybuilders and just a few of the big names) won't be readily available for some time anyway so it makes no point to get heated about it all. . .
If the past has taught anything these will sell no matter what. . .
Just my thoughts. . .

[Crazy Legs]

this thread is about sucky packaging and figures!
Please go have your history lesson about JOE releases in another place. Thank you.

Now, if i remember correctly, i think quad-laucher looks like one of the weapons movie Ironhide figures came with. That and the new Marvel Legends Blade having that same rifle as this Duke...... makes it look like Hasbro is really saving some cash.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Take off Beachhead's tact vest. That's Reactive armor under there.

Desert Battle Heavy Duty: Reactive Armor

City Strike Scarlett was canceled.

Jungle Assault Ripcord, City Strike Duke, Jungle Assault Duke (original one had a Tatum head) = all have reactive impact armor on.

Jungle Assault Cobra Commander = RoC CC

PoC was originally meant to be a continuation of RoC to transition the line until the sequel.

Thats called part rehash and kitbashing with minimal cost...not a contiuation. Most of the figures you mentioned were still part of ROC. Jungle Assault cobra commnader was a chase figure...the second Arctic commander quickly idstance itself.

Even retaliaiton dosent have any nanomites or RIA...this dukeis a perfect example. BUt yet everyone claims its a continuation or ROC.

[Troynos]

You don't need all the elements to make a continuation.

The last wave of RoC was meant the transition to PoC, that's when they started putting the PoC environments on the packaging.

[Derek2783]

i love the whole quadruple missile launcher. its a clear message to tankers. we heard you, but these toys are NOT made for you. so we are quadrupling down on the missile launchers.

Haha! That was funny...

[Fred Broca XIII]

Thank you for the tactfulness of your reply...LOVE replies that start with "actually, you are wrong"...there's different ways in which your information could've been communicated, but this was the least condescending of all....ha.

So I don't know all the details about the points you've brought to the table (while ignoring all the other 90 points I wrote about). But even still, I HIGHLY doubt the royalties to pay Paramount come even close to the type of royalties that Hasbro has to pay Lucasfilm (or Marvel) for figures that have the same price point that these half-assed versions of Joe toys are going to have.

They're cutting from every corner of the toy line including quality of product and playability, while raising the price!

...the saying "don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining" comes to mind, is all.

Well that is his schtick...disassembling posts of others and telling them how they are wrong about everything they said...it seems like he does it on every other one of my posts...he's just stirring the shit paddle because he has no real life outside of this forum...

[Fred Broca XIII]

unfortunately cost cutting isn't about saving money for the customer, it's about making bigger profits for the manufacturer.

bingo!

[Steevy Maximus]

Yeah because the market already had its fill of the revision cases very quickly...that over saturated the line
It is worth noting that the dreaded "revision cases" were produced in response to the FANS complaints of the time:
fans complained at "not enough product", so Hasbro produced revision cases to get more product on shelves.
Not only that, those cases were composed almost ENTIRELY of figures fans were bitching about not being able to find or cheaply on the secondary market (like Flint, Beachhead, Snow Job, the Crimson Guard, Firefly, Snow Serpent, etc)

It was similar to the mess Hall of Heroes voting became: instead of voting on what they really wanted, or what they would want later on, fans voted based on what was rare AT THAT MOMENT. More than half of HoH selections were done based on what was rare circa march 2008, and when they finally hit retail a year later, none of those characters were rare anymore.

[Fred Broca XIII]

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmlawn View Post
Nothing learned from history. What killed the Joe line in the 90s? big bright weapons, and too much focus on ninjas. The package art looks like the wwe wrestling figure art, Hasbro is trying to grab the wwe fans because the Rock is in the movie.
I was looking forward to the movie & the toy line, but now I just want it to be over so we can get back to good Joe stuff.

that simply isn't true at all. what killed the line in the 90's was that the generation of kids that made it popular in the 80's outgrew it, and the generation of kids in the 90's were more interested in new toy brands like TMNT.

fact is, the changes you mentioned did not cause the decline, they were a response to existing decline to try to appeal to what the new generation of kids in the 90's preferred.


It may not be true in your eyes but really bright neon weapons killed the mood for me and most of my friends at that time, the focus on the ninjas didn't bother me as much, as the stupid hurricane kick and judo chop crap they added that hampered their articulation...GI Joe was appealing to me and my friends at the time because the "realism" of the line (compared to other janky-ass toys with almost no articulation or abysmal sculpts)...when everything started going futuristic and neon it got stupid...kids who grew up with GI Joe in the 80's are still buying them today, so I doubt they grew out of it in the 90's if that were the case there wouldn't be a need for this forum site..

[CrimsonGuard101]

It is worth noting that the dreaded "revision cases" were produced in response to the FANS complaints of the time:
fans complained at "not enough product", so Hasbro produced revision cases to get more product on shelves.
Not only that, those cases were composed almost ENTIRELY of figures fans were bitching about not being able to find or cheaply on the secondary market (like Flint, Beachhead, Snow Job, the Crimson Guard, Firefly, Snow Serpent, etc)

It was similar to the mess Hall of Heroes voting became: instead of voting on what they really wanted, or what they would want later on, fans voted based on what was rare AT THAT MOMENT. More than half of HoH selections were done based on what was rare circa march 2008, and when they finally hit retail a year later, none of those characters were rare anymore.

Still got to retail somehow...they dont usually listen to the fans...if so...Joe would be a greater presance then The Corps at Walmart...wasnt HoH etailer product?

[Troynos]

kids who grew up with GI Joe in the 80's are still buying them today, so I doubt they grew out of it in the 90's if that were the case there wouldn't be a need for this forum site..

I grew out of it in the 90s. Came back in because of the 25th.

[CrimsonGuard101]

I grew out of it in the 90s. Came back in because of the 25th.

yes, '91 was about the end of it all for me till the 25th. I dunno what happned between '91 and 2007 but it sure remains a dark and voided part of my mind when it comes to Joe lol...cept for the DTC Hiss and Humvee....those were pretty damn nice.

[Fred Broca XIII]

I grew out of it in the 90s. Came back in because of the 25th.

I guess some of us never grew out of GI Joe...it has been one of my static collectibles since I started collecting it, I even traded off all my other crap to my friends to get their GI Joes (He-Man, TMNT, Transformers etc....)...I remember I got picky about what I picked up when all the guns started going neon...it really did kill the mood for me when it came to collecting, then I was sad that they discontinued them shortly after the Ninja stuff...I was pretty stoked when they started coming back out in the late 90's though...

[Fred Broca XIII]

wow...just looked at that duke...yikes...not even a "pick it up for parts" figure...and we are back to the orange weapons I see...awesome...camouflage be damned...

[gunslingercbr]

It may not be true in your eyes but really bright neon weapons killed the mood for me and most of my friends at that time, the focus on the ninjas didn't bother me as much, as the stupid hurricane kick and judo chop crap they added that hampered their articulation...GI Joe was appealing to me and my friends at the time because the "realism" of the line (compared to other janky-ass toys with almost no articulation or abysmal sculpts)...when everything started going futuristic and neon it got stupid...kids who grew up with GI Joe in the 80's are still buying them today, so I doubt they grew out of it in the 90's if that were the case there wouldn't be a need for this forum site..

you have to be joking.

most of the people here resumed collecting as adults, they didn't collect from when they were 5 straight through to today.

fact is the majority of collectors outgrew toys as they entered their teenage years, hence why sales declined at the end of the 80's -- the Joe kid outgrew it and started playing sports, chasing girls and being teenagers. they certainly didn't keep playing with toys. this isn't even unique to G.I. Joe consumers, it happens to every toyline with every generation.

nobody cares about your personal experience, we are talking about the market as a whole. and the market as a whole stopped playing with G.I. Joes at some point in their youth, then some of us picked it back up as adults.

[Fred Broca XIII]

you have to be joking.

most of the people here resumed collecting as adults, they didn't collect from when they were 5 straight through to today.

fact is the majority of collectors outgrew toys as they entered their teenage years, hence why sales declined at the end of the 80's -- the Joe kid outgrew it.

nobody cares about your personal experience, we are talking about the market as a whole. and the market as a whole stopped playing with G.I. Joes at some point in their youth, then picked it back up as adults.

I am glad you figured out that I have a sense of humor...now if we could just get you one too...

...If you collected it in the 80's then stopped in the 90's but started again at the 25th anniversary or DTC, I have a news flash...you didn't grow out of anything, you just had a relapse back to what you enjoyed as a child after a brief/not-so-brief stint without decent options for collecting...it would be like a heroin user quitting heroin because of a bad batch and saying "I grew out of heroin", then some badass china-white comes along and our former heroin user is using heroin again...who grew out of what now? heroin is probably a bad example, but you can insert almost anything into that equation...
...arguing about the individual preferences of thousands of people in the 90's is a bit asinine really...I did what I did, you did what you did...nuff said...

[gunslingercbr]

I am glad you figured out that I have a sense of humor...now if we could just get you one too...

...arguing about the individual preferences of thousands of people in the 90's is a bit asinine really...I did what I did, you did what you did...nuff said...

we aren't arguing about individual preferences. you are. I am talking about the toy market as a whole.

your claim that kids who grew up in the 80's that still buy Joes now must mean they never stopped collecting at all in between doesn't reflect collectors as a whole. sure, some may have, but if you spend enough time in the community you will realize you are the exception, not the rule. this isn't speculation.

the fact is the majority of kids who played with Joes as kids outgrew them. not just Joes, all toys. that is what kids do. we grow up and get new interests.

your post wanted to negate that fact, that sales of G.I. Joe declined not because the consumer that made them successful in outgrew toys but because the brand changed and then they stopped collecting because of that. that simply isn't so.

if that were the case, sales wouldn't have began dipping prior to the changes you point to as the catalyst and the brand would still be selling today at the same levels as it did in 1985. why hasn't it?

[gunslingercbr]

you didn't grow out of anything, you just had a relapse back to what you enjoyed as a child after a brief stint without decent options for collecting..

that is just beyond asinine.

no, I outgrew toys as I became a teenager, then like many other collectors had a surge of nostalgia as an adult. the idea that I was always itching for toys is ridiculous.

[CrimsonGuard101]

I wish I had been collecting the joes I had in the 80's...they were just toys back then....not expsnive mantoy collectibles that I spend way to much money on now lol...all the money I could have saved on vintage vehicles...I had them all..and I destoyed them all...oh well...if I could go back and relive 82-91 over and over and over again wihtout end...that would be heaven...

[Fred Broca XIII]

that is just beyond asinine.

no, I outgrew toys as I became a teenager, then like many other collectors had a surge of nostalgia as an adult. the idea that I was always itching for toys is ridiculous.

...and yet you continue arguing...keep stirring that shit paddle...you might make it to shore...if you don't care about individual opinion, quit responding to it...

[azrael13]

Hahahahahahahahaha - Hasbro, you silly, sad, money-hungry glutton you. This is just terrible - THIS is what you come out with after ROC was a bomb? Now that this movie brings so much hope and possiblity, even a return for many fans? You have created a delicious blend of utter failure and molded garbage to dish out to buyers. So this is how Hasbro will be represented now; with lame-tooled, generic-inspired, cutback-developed, unoriginal-detailed action figures. I have a strange feeling I will see these figures sitting on the same shelf or store rack for months, before they eventually end up in the "discount" bin (*cough*) once again (*cough-cough* (ROC)). My guess is only based on a mere 27 years of collecting from the Joe franchise and watching Hasbro's ups-and-downs with the line. Then again, I'm not 8 anymore, and when you get down to it, the Joes are still geared to the kids, and all of their marketing that follows. The collectors and long-time fans I guess will have to sit back and suck it up. At least, I imagine, that's what Hasbro is basically telling us with this line. Can't blame the company either. It is after money, that's the prime goal of any successful company. And if you can make cut-backs, use less resources and materials, save on money all to gain profit without any loss, why not? You're still putting out fodder, and you know it, you just won't acknowledge it of course, Mr. Hasbro.

[RANGER SMITTY]

Duke looks like crap. It seems that Hasbro hasn't finished screwing with their toy lines. First they screwed over TF fans with the DOTM line, now the Joe fans are going to suffer as well it seems.

[Fred Broca XIII]

I wish I had been collecting the joes I had in the 80's...they were just toys back then....not expsnive mantoy collectibles that I spend way to much money on now lol...all the money I could have saved on vintage vehicles...I had them all..and I destoyed them all...oh well...if I could go back and relive 82-91 over and over and over again wihtout end...that would be heaven...


Yeah I'm glad I still have most of my old stuff, I had to buy my own GI Joes most of the time, so I took awesome care of them, my dad built me a whole wall of shelves to display them, so I ended up collecting them more than actually playing with them...there is some stuff I'm trying to replace that I used to have...when I moved to the midwest one of my two storage units was robbed and they got two big ass boxes that had GI Joe vehicles in them...

[Fred Broca XIII]

Hahahahahahahahaha - Hasbro, you silly, sad, money-hungry glutton you. This is just terrible - THIS is what you come out with after ROC was a bomb? Now that this movie brings so much hope and possiblity, even a return for many fans? You have created a delicious blend of utter failure and molded garbage to dish out to buyers. So this is how Hasbro will be represented now; with lame-tooled, generic-inspired, cutback-developed, unoriginal-detailed action figures. I have a strange feeling I will see these figures sitting on the same shelf or store rack for months, before they eventually end up in the "discount" bin (*cough*) once again (*cough-cough* (ROC)). My guess is only based on a mere 27 years of collecting from the Joe franchise and watching Hasbro's ups-and-downs with the line. Then again, I'm not 8 anymore, and when you get down to it, the Joes are still geared to the kids, and all of their marketing that follows. The collectors and long-time fans I guess will have to sit back and suck it up. At least, I imagine, that's what Hasbro is basically telling us with this line. Can't blame the company either. It is after money, that's the prime goal of any successful company. And if you can make cut-backs, use less resources and materials, save on money all to gain profit without any loss, why not? You're still putting out fodder, and you know it, you just won't acknowledge it of course, Mr. Hasbro.

Nice to see another who didn't "grow out" of collecting GI Joes...looks like we are the only two according to some...

[brock Samson]

Back on Topic

[spiderpumpkin]

Well, I think we know what figure will be on clearance at retail.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Yeah I'm glad I still have most of my old stuff, I had to buy my own GI Joes most of the time, so I took awesome care of them, my dad built me a whole wall of shelves to display them, so I ended up collecting them more than actually playing with them...there is some stuff I'm trying to replace that I used to have...when I moved to the midwest one of my two storage units was robbed and they got two big ass boxes that had GI Joe vehicles in them...

You sure you somehow didnt end up in the future(circa now) and went back in time? I dont remeber any of my freinds having shelves for displaying figures..they all had toy boxes and closet full of crap....only the moms had curio shelves or vases on pedastals and the sorts of things you would find in most 80s era furnished homes, like lighted paintings and pics of the family lol...

[gunslingercbr]

Back on Topic

[Troops of Doom]

Duke looks like he should team up with Sci-Fi.

[Python_Puckman]

This will be perfect for my 21 Jump Street dio!!!

[gunslingercbr]

Back on Topic

[DESTRO]

no, because it has been reported that Paramount does the same for G.I. Joe. show me where I am wrong that there is a different deal in place for G.I. Joe.

these are facts. you have nothing to base your position on, so you simply want to claim that the deals must be different but have no proof to back tat up.


Settle down guys....

Thanks

[brock Samson]

no, because it has been reported that Paramount does the same for G.I. Joe. show me where I am wrong that there is a different deal in place for G.I. Joe.

these are facts. you have nothing to base your position on, so you simply want to claim that the deals must be different but have no proof to back tat up.

that is beyond

Your lack of proof to support your argument is pathetic. Why don't you spend more of your time finding arguments that don't contradict your earlier posts. You dug up research that shows GIJoe is a 10th the sales of Transformers so you can't support your argument off other articles related to the Transformers contract. Now that is f'ing submoronic.

I didn't put it out there in the first place, I just called your typical bullshit. If you can't back up your statement then back out of the argument.

[Crimson Rage]

Nothing learned from history. What killed the Joe line in the 90s? big bright weapons, and too much focus on ninjas. The package art looks like the wwe wrestling figure art, Hasbro is trying to grab the wwe fans because the Rock is in the movie.
I was looking forward to the movie & the toy line, but now I just want it to be over so we can get back to good Joe stuff.

Nah, "growing up" killed the line back then. If I had somehow managed to stay 10 years old for the past three decades, I would have loved the Mega Marines, Star Brigade and Eco Warrior eras

And no, I am not being sarcastic - To a kiddie's eyes those things we 'adults' loathe so much must look awesome, which is why this movie line might do better than the muted, literal and, with hindsight, more 'realistic' ROC toys.

[gunslingercbr]

Back on Topic

[brock Samson]

Back on Topic

[SDawg]

Good for fodder though. I sure could use the legs lol

[gunslingercbr]

Back on Topic

[brock Samson]

Back on Topic Please.

[DESTRO]

Back on Topic please.

[jeffafa]

Putting random characters on the card art makes it a lot harder to rummage through pegs looking for a specific figure. I like it better when the individual character has his/her image on their card.

[Stuart_Selkirk]

I won't be buying CC or Duke, but I'm looking forward to a bunch of other Retaliation figures and I want multiples of some of them.
What I've seen of them so far looks promising and I don't care how the packaging looks. After all, I want the figures and I'll be taking most of them, if not all of them, apart for customs anyway.

I couldn't care less about the trash - and that's what the packaging is to me.

BTW: it is pathetic to talk about your 80s era toy experience as kids while mentioning the new figures. There is not one single thing which makes those toys comparable in any way to the figures of today. The modern figures like ROC (yes, even this line), POC and 30th are in every respect better and more up to date than those rubber-banded 80s hard plastic things. The only thing which makes them somewhat special is the personal nostalgia which connects you to those toys.

[Nightrain]

Well, I think we know what figure will be on clearance at retail.

All of them?

[Fred Broca XIII]

Good for fodder though. I sure could use the legs lol

Yeah...this might be good to do some non-joe customs...I do like the legs after taking a second look...

[wormsolo72]

Has anyone stated yet, that if this movie is going more main stream hard core military, then why are the toys coming out in neon colors. The first movie figs were from more sci-fi style design, but were more military camo. This to me is going the route of the old neon Battlecorps style. Cobra Trooper: "Were are the Joes at ?????" Cobra Viper: " Over there idiot, can't you see their day glow neon uniforms and weapons in the jungle !!!!! Now FIRE !!!!!"

[Fred Broca XIII]

Putting random characters on the card art makes it a lot harder to rummage through pegs looking for a specific figure. I like it better when the individual character has his/her image on their card.

Stores in your area have figures on pegs?...all the stores around me have been out of stock since before xmas (no, arctic strike destro, desert strike duke, and renegades firefly do not count)...haha...I do feel what you are saying...it was like fishing through the Iron Man figures, you had to catch them from the side with the numbers to find the ones you wanted, which also required knowing what figure numbers were...

[Fred Broca XIII]

Has anyone stated yet, that if this movie is going more main stream hard core military, then why are the toys coming out in neon colors. The first movie figs were from more sci-fi style design, but were more military camo. This to me is going the route of the old neon Battlecorps style. Cobra Trooper: "Were are the Joes at ?????" Cobra Viper: " Over there idiot, can't you see their day glow neon uniforms and weapons in the jungle !!!!! Now FIRE !!!!!"

Yeah...I was bitching about it earlier and saw a couple of comments about it too...but you expressed it better than I did...

[CrimsonGuard101]

Yeah...this might be good to do some non-joe customs...I do like the legs after taking a second look...

Hopefully they wont be plastic welding them togther to where taking them apart runs the risk or destroying them (one of my Renegades Airtights had its legs so glued/fused it didnt even need the screw)...dunno what this duke would be useful for...I hope I can find the ones I want at retail..I am really not wanting to have to pre-order full cases of these things...

[Fred Broca XIII]

Hopefully they wont be plastic welding them togther to where taking them apart runs the risk or destroying them (one of my Renegades Airtights had its legs so glued/fused it didnt even need the screw)...dunno what this duke would be useful for...I hope I can find the ones I want at retail..I am really not wanting to have to pre-order full cases of these things...

I broke a 25th Bazooka trying to pop the torso because it was glued pretty thoroughly...cracked the back of the torso in half...I miss screws and o-rings for that reason alone...I've broken a few Marvel U figures trying to make customs too...

[80sKid]

As I said when the packaging was first displayed I am not happy with it but my wallet is. I will be supporting the line as I like many of the figures it's just like ROC, I will not be keeping any MOC which is one less per every figure I want.

[stlcujo]

Why are they making such unrealistic weapons for these figures?! This stinks to high heaven! No man could carry such a weapon. Hasbro has lost it. Major fail!

[docdrako]

Except for the weapons and the Duke head, I like the Duke figure. Custom fodder for me.

I will support you GI Joe, through thick and thin. You've given me years of imaginative play, and I look forward to many more!

My sons and I thank you.

[c_money_collins]

I like it. Especially for fodder. Those are Boba Fett boots Duke has on.

[WeaponXIII]

Well that is his schtick...disassembling posts of others and telling them how they are wrong about everything they said...it seems like he does it on every other one of my posts...he's just stirring the shit paddle because he has no real life outside of this forum...

Man, I rarely post on toy forums and it's exactly because of people like Gunslinger. It's not even that he has opposing arguments...it's his abrasive know-it-all way of communicating. But don't worry, that attitude doesn't win anyone over. Perhaps it was my fault for paying enough attention to his response, and in turn replying back in the first place.

Anyway, on the subject of this Duke figure? Let's vote with our dollars, people. If we buy the crap they throw at us, they will be rewarded with the reassurance that they can sell us crap for higher prices...in turn changing their business model to ONLY selling us lower-quality crap.

But if we only buy the items that are worth-a-while, it let's them know that if they wanna keep making money from us, then quality of product must stand.

Hasbro doesn't need loyalists...trust me, they're no independent company...they make enough money as it is. And if you want a good line to share with your kids?...it looks like Playmates is hitting it outta the park with the new Ninja Turtles line coming out this year : )

[Black Rose]

This Duke fig is a definite pass.

[Ford]

It may say "Duke", but that will be "Grand Slam" to me. And I bet if they slapped it on a Renegards card and marketed as such, half the people here would be gushing about it.

[jim0680]

I like the overall look of the figure but come on with the orange safety gun already. Marauder will love this line.

[dpstro]

Man, I rarely post on toy forums and it's exactly because of people like Gunslinger. It's not even that he has opposing arguments...it's his abrasive know-it-all way of communicating. But don't worry, that attitude doesn't win anyone over. Perhaps it was my fault for paying enough attention to his response, and in turn replying back in the first place.

Anyway, on the subject of this Duke figure? Let's vote with our dollars, people. If we buy the crap they throw at us, they will be rewarded with the reassurance that they can sell us crap for higher prices...in turn changing their business model to ONLY selling us lower-quality crap.

But if we only buy the items that are worth-a-while, it let's them know that if they wanna keep making money from us, then quality of product must stand.

Hasbro doesn't need loyalists...trust me, they're no independent company...they make enough money as it is. And if you want a good line to share with your kids?...it looks like Playmates is hitting it outta the park with the new Ninja Turtles line coming out this year : )

I like this idea. And will join the cause. This is also the reason I bought so much 25th anniversary and so many Sky Strikers.

[SunDown]

Holy Sh!t. That is absolutely terrible looking. And I thought some of the ROC Joe stuff was bad........

[azrael13]

I won't be buying CC or Duke, but I'm looking forward to a bunch of other Retaliation figures and I want multiples of some of them.
What I've seen of them so far looks promising and I don't care how the packaging looks. After all, I want the figures and I'll be taking most of them, if not all of them, apart for customs anyway.

I couldn't care less about the trash - and that's what the packaging is to me.

BTW: it is pathetic to talk about your 80s era toy experience as kids while mentioning the new figures. There is not one single thing which makes those toys comparable in any way to the figures of today. The modern figures like ROC (yes, even this line), POC and 30th are in every respect better and more up to date than those rubber-banded 80s hard plastic things. The only thing which makes them somewhat special is the personal nostalgia which connects you to those toys.


I don't know if anyone is neseccarily "comparing" their 80's figures with that of today. I believe they are stating that for the time, those toys were a hit and great for what was around or for what was simply capable of being manufactured with the technology provided then. The Joes of today are great for what they are with today's standards, and with the technology that is provided, as well. Both ROC, POC, etc., lines as far as today's tooling is concerned is incredible. What is not a hit is the design of these new Retaliation figures. I think the comparison that is being made is simply that those figures from the 80's were great for then, and these figures for this next particluar line are not so great for today. I love my 80's Joes, great memories and nostalgia there (wouldn't sell 'em for anything) but I do love my Snake Eyes and Commanders from both the POC, 30th, even some of the ROC lines. Peeps just had high hopes with this next line, especially because this next movie seems like it's the movie we've been waiting for. So, I don't think it's pathetic when people compare what they love, because, I suspect if they are coming here to read the forums and take the time to post, they are still loyal fans and collecting after all these years - and their input certainly matters and counts!

[GrapeSoda]

i was making the toy rounds today looking for some different figures, and i noticed all the price points for joes have been raised CONSIDERABLY!
toys r us: $9.99
target: $10.99
cvs: $11.99
wal-mart: there were 12 empty pegs (save for the 3 artic destros) and they had the price of $6.95

is this the new price point for these figs?

[Ash Talon]

The Duke figure itself looks cool. Are we really complaining about a Duke figure? Why? We know from Toy Fair that there are only a few figures with giant accessories. Most come with a decent amount of gear. And the few that have gimmicky accessories also have regular figures coming out at as well, like that awesome green Roadblock.

I just love how one figure of a character that many feel is over-exposed has a gimmicky accessory, and the line is suddenly doomed and the end of the brand for some.

[Steevy Maximus]

i was making the toy rounds today looking for some different figures, and i noticed all the price points for joes have been raised CONSIDERABLY!
toys r us: $9.99
target: $10.99
cvs: $11.99
wal-mart: there were 12 empty pegs (save for the 3 artic destros) and they had the price of $6.95

is this the new price point for these figs?
Hasbro's MSRP will be $7.99 for Retaliation single figures, and I think HAS been the MSRP since last summer.
Ultimately, it is retailers' decision where to price the product (keep in mind Hasbro's MSRP in fall 2010 was only $5.99, but only HTS actually priced the product at such).

The more recent price raises are likely a result of retailers trying to squeeze a few extra bucks from a low volume collector driven rather than just dump the line for the few weeks until Retaliation product hits.

[stknrobert1071]

i kinda see potential for the duke... im adding a jetpack like that what came with hawk back in the 90's a rocket launcher and a visored helmet...paint his hair black...and call him starduster or grand slam...or starslam

[DARKWIND]

this thread is about sucky packaging and figures!
Please go have your history lesson about JOE releases in another place. Thank you.

That's funny, if you took a sec and read what has been posted over the last umpteen pages you might see a few history lessons being put to use for both sides. . .

But. . .
Ok for those who have to bitch and moan, I am not a big fan of the packaging either, but I am not going let it stop me from collecting, customizing and posting on an open forum.

[jcast]

Man, I rarely post on toy forums and it's exactly because of people like Gunslinger. It's not even that he has opposing arguments...it's his abrasive know-it-all way of communicating. But don't worry, that attitude doesn't win anyone over. Perhaps it was my fault for paying enough attention to his response, and in turn replying back in the first place...

Look at it this way; at least he didn't imply you were gay.

[Shin Densetsu]

Figure looks a lot better than it did in the initial press kit images. Looks like a good generic body, might just shove a helmet on it and make it a random vehicle driver.

[ljacone]

I like the Duke figure but if I get him he has to get some new accessories. I do not like his gun at all.

I could care less about the packaging to be honest. I'm pretty ambivalent towards it, which is a shame because I liked the POC and 30th style cards quite a bit.

[Torgos-Pizza]

What a stinkburger! I guess I'll be saving some money passing on all these shitty figures.

[Laser Viper]

Yeah...i wont but buying Duke, but CC on the other hand, now i really like that figure.

[Crimson Rage]

Man, I rarely post on toy forums and it's exactly because of people like Gunslinger. It's not even that he has opposing arguments...it's his abrasive know-it-all way of communicating. But don't worry, that attitude doesn't win anyone over. Perhaps it was my fault for paying enough attention to his response, and in turn replying back in the first place.


Oh, Gunslinger won me over for the simple fact he's usually right. He doesn't insult for the sake of it, just points out weak, baseless 'arguments' that some folk try to pass of as 'fact'. Some people just lose their temper when presented with reasoned logic, that's all.

And that DUKE sucks.

[Fred Broca XIII]

Figure looks a lot better than it did in the initial press kit images. Looks like a good generic body, might just shove a helmet on it and make it a random vehicle driver.

I had a similar idea to use it to make greenshirts with some of my loose heads in my custom bin...maybe use that giant unwieldy missile launcher on a customized vehicle or something and definitely paint that garish orange gun a reasonable color...orange...seriously, is it an airsoft gun? ...is this why nobody dies in the cartoon, because they use airsoft? ...I always thought it was because Cobra Troopers were trained to shoot by Stormtroopers...

[WeaponXIII]

Oh, Gunslinger won me over for the simple fact he's usually right. He doesn't insult for the sake of it, just points out weak, baseless 'arguments' that some folk try to pass of as 'fact'. Some people just lose their temper when presented with reasoned logic, that's all.


Sir, perhaps you and I did not read the same posts, nor do we value people's characters based on the same criteria. But I do hope we can still freely discuss toys in an amicable manner : )

[Darth_Risar]

Yeah, and they're bringing back the goofy colored weapons too. There's a reason that Marauder John doesn't make orange-colored rifles.

If all these figures have the same crap weapons then I may have to place an order with John, or not considering the weapon and equipment load out that some of the more recent figures have come with. I can understand the kid sized weapons being this color for safety reasons, but the figures don’t need to have a rainbow of firepower. This is just insane. What normal little boy is going to want a soldier with an orange rifle? And those over sized spring weapons need to go as well. I would much rather have 1:18 scale weapons cases and footlockers to store the gear. Not all toys need a gimmick.

[Troynos]

[QUOTE=wormsolo72;3444694]Has anyone stated yet, that if this movie is going more main stream hard core military, then why are the toys coming out in neon colors. The first movie figs were from more sci-fi style design, but were more military camo.QUOTE]

The initial designs aren't fully based on the movie. Because of the timing involved, Hasbro had to create some figures for the first waves before the final designs of the movie were done.

[Darth_Risar]

[QUOTE=Troynos;3443896]Ruin it to who? The fans that stopped buying which led to the decline in sales?




The reason Joe gets rebooted is because it doesn't sell. If the concept on the market isn't selling, you introduce a new concept and try to get that one to sell. If that doesn't sell, then you introduce a new one, and so on and so on until something clicks.


Do we have to like it? No. But that's the reality of the situation.


Which is why in the 70's we got the Adventure Team, people were sick of the Vietnam war and war toys really weren't selling that well. Which I also think is why in the early 80's ARAH line sold so well is because of a shift in thinking, kids wanted there heroes to be soldiers.

[funskool]

because kids like neon missile launchers. package should say missile launcher also includes a figure as a bonus.

the boxes should say now with less articulation for making poses less difficult.

[Troynos]

Which is why in the 70's we got the Adventure Team, people were sick of the Vietnam war and war toys really weren't selling that well. Which I also think is why in the early 80's ARAH line sold so well is because of a shift in thinking, kids wanted there heroes to be soldiers.

Right.

The concept of Joe has evolved depending on the "mood" of the demographic at the time.



I could see a new version of Adventure Team working pretty well nowadays.

An anti-terrorist/exploration/rescue unit.

[funskool]

Right.

The concept of Joe has evolved depending on the "mood" of the demographic at the time.



I could see a new version of Adventure Team working pretty well nowadays.

An anti-terrorist/exploration/rescue unit.

neon adventure people

[Fred Broca XIII]

Sir, perhaps you and I did not read the same posts, nor do we value people's characters based on the same criteria. But I do hope we can still freely discuss toys in an amicable manner : )


...well said...

[Fred Broca XIII]

[QUOTE=Troynos;3443896]Ruin it to who? The fans that stopped buying which led to the decline in sales?




The reason Joe gets rebooted is because it doesn't sell. If the concept on the market isn't selling, you introduce a new concept and try to get that one to sell. If that doesn't sell, then you introduce a new one, and so on and so on until something clicks.


Do we have to like it? No. But that's the reality of the situation.


Which is why in the 70's we got the Adventure Team, people were sick of the Vietnam war and war toys really weren't selling that well. Which I also think is why in the early 80's ARAH line sold so well is because of a shift in thinking, kids wanted there heroes to be soldiers.

Yeah...it's hard to sell something if you can never find it in stores...my area has been out of stock since november...last wave we saw was the one with renegades CC and Firefly...

[Crimson Rage]

Sir, perhaps you and I did not read the same posts, nor do we value people's characters based on the same criteria. But I do hope we can still freely discuss toys in an amicable manner : )

I don't value his "character" at all, for the simple reason he's a total stranger that I have never met, ergo I am unable to judge said character.

...well said...

In other words, you don't like him either and you're glad someone agrees with you.

Sorry mods.., no more off-topic shenanigans from me.

[CrimsonGuard101]

I have about decided to just get the SDCC Hiss Destro/Bat set (not going to bother with the 2 SDCC Jinx figures, I have no attachment to her), Single Carded RoadRock in the green camo tank x2 (one for Sarge, one for the rock), Bruce Willis x2 (cause its bruce willis as a friggen joe, how many times that going to ever happen again) one to open and one to keep carded, the new Single Carded Snake Eyes from the movie likeness and the new single carded Storm Shadow (the best to date), the Ninja 3 pack with Slice, one black dragon Ninja, and 5 Red Ninjas and that will be about it for waves 1-3. Then I will want 7 Crimson Guards and 7 Night Vipers from the final wave IF IT MAKES it to etail/retail. The rest can hang on the pegs with its ROC brothers at Ross/Family Dollar or where ever else they can find to peg warm lol....passing up the vehicles and the other 3 pack, no need of any of those figures, especially the vapoorize vehicle drivers. Not going to get sucked into the "try and fix the drivers" game.

[Fred Broca XIII]

In other words, you don't like him either and you're glad someone agrees with you.

Sorry mods.., no more off-topic shenanigans from me.

Basically...but it's not really a matter of not liking him...as you said, I don't know him...it's how he comes off in his posts with the know-it-all condescension...I don't mind someone informing me that my information may not be correct or reflect market trends, but there are more civil ways of doing such things, and he was ignorant of them...and when almost every post you make is attacked in such a way it makes it hard to like someone like that...

Sorry mods.., no more off-topic shenanigans from me....ditto for me too...

[Nightrain]

I'm only getting Actor Bruce Willis(which will be shortpacked I'm sure). Why do I like GI Joe again?

[Fred Broca XIII]

I'm only getting Actor Bruce Willis(which will be shortpacked I'm sure). Why do I like GI Joe again?

Bruce Willis figure is a must for me too, prolly two or three so I can make a custom John McClane and maybe a Korben Dallas (me and everyone else that customizes I'm sure)...but then again I'm also stoked about the RZA figure, I'm pretty stoked he's in the movie by itself...I grew up with the Gravediggaz and Wu Tang Clan (influences, not literally), and I loved watching the weekend kung fu flicks they hosted...

[ilzuccone]

Bruce Willis figure is a must for me too, prolly two or three so I can make a custom John McClane

Great now i have to get two also.

[ksensor]

That missile cannon thing reminds me of the one that came with the 1992 base. That looked cool, this... not so much.

[Fred Broca XIII]

Great now i have to get two also.

HaHa...sorry...I figured everyone else already had the idea to do it...

[Jinx723]

Don't go running to Sears just yet.

Fellow 'Tanker' skywarrped found a few online links on K-mart/Sears site, featuring Retaliation figures @ $9.99. I'm surprised these are even up considering the Retaliation toy line is not out for another two months.
http://www.hisstank.com/forum/g-i-joe-news-rumors/215947-gijoe-retaliation-movie-action-figure-images-7.html



http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc219/gquintero723/spin_prod_662333501.jpg

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc219/gquintero723/spin_prod_662334801.jpg

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc219/gquintero723/spin_prod_662337901.jpg

[ndb]

Those actually look pretty good, except Dukes huge thighs.

[Night_Force_GI_EDDO]

i wonder if they are available to sell. it says i can buy it at kmart.com. weird.

[Night_Force_GI_EDDO]

no that i look at it, it says it's not available to ship.... and its available, but not in stores....so...yeah.

[Gyre-Viper]

K-Mart has a terrible terrible terrible problem with having items listed that it never actually carries.

[Cobra Terrorist]

K-Mart has a terrible terrible terrible problem with having items listed that it never actually carries.

Yeah, I've heard stories about that.


Never ever ever ever ever ever order from Kmart.com, folks.

[Jeffrozup]

Yeah, I've heard stories about that.


Never ever ever ever ever ever order from Kmart.com, folks.

I wouldn't say that but I would say don't order new or hot items from kmart. I ordered some DCUC figures and got the right ones but they were figures that had been out for a few months.

No way does Sears or Kmart get these figures before anybody else.

[07GT500 COBRA]

The Rock's head is sitting too high on those neck and traps muscles.

[drunknmunky]

What is wrong with the Commander's leg? That thing needs a huge adjustment. Looks like he has a tumor on his thigh.
Roadblock has a funny expression. Looks like he's saying ” does anyone have an idea of how the hell I can put this gun down?”

[Deefuzz]

And now there's a Zartan!

G.I. Joe Retaliation Zartan Packaging - GI Joe News (http://www.hisstank.com/gi-joe-news/gi-joe-movie-2/gi-joe-retaliation-zartan-packaging-11168/)

[RuckusJr]

I have about decided to just get the SDCC Hiss Destro/Bat set...

Good luck with that.

[This I Command!]

I know this has already been said a bunch of times, I can see past the launchers, but that packaging absolutely SUCKS. One of the staples of Joe is individual character art, it really makes these feel like every other movie toyline, not good.

[red4]

Good luck with that.

translation: Yeah right, jack ass.

[aussietrooper20]

I'm hoping that Zartan turns into this somewhere in the film,cause if he does, it could be that maybe that is Zartan snake eyes fights as Storm Shadow, or Storm Shadow fighting Zartan who's disguised as Snake eyes.

[GrapeSoda]

Bruce Willis figure is a must for me too, prolly two or three so I can make a custom John McClane and maybe a Korben Dallas (me and everyone else that customizes I'm sure)...but then again I'm also stoked about the RZA figure, I'm pretty stoked he's in the movie by itself...I grew up with the Gravediggaz and Wu Tang Clan (influences, not literally), and I loved watching the weekend kung fu flicks they hosted...

i think, there in lies my dilemma: i REALLY want to get my hands on 3 of those bruce willis figs for customs alone....but he will most undoubtedly be shortpacked AND in one of the later waves AND also sought after by other customizers. it's gonna be "shadow tracker" all over again for me.

[CJCJ]

I'm hoping that Zartan turns into this somewhere in the film,cause if he does, it could be that maybe that is Zartan snake eyes fights as Storm Shadow, or Storm Shadow fighting Zartan who's disguised as Snake eyes.

Isn't this basically Renegades Zartan?

The ROC line was sprinkled with 25th Resolute figs. Hmm.. might Hasbro possibly string fandom along by continuing Renegades within the Retaliation line? (I'm hoping for TRU and WalMart exclusives being aimed at fans like in ROC)

[Stnick8541]

I am usually rather quiet about such posts but my goodness Hasbro. Blue weapons and no file card with a crappy nearly same card front for each character. Get a clue!!! As an enthusiastic collector of the 80's I have brought several young family members and kids of friends into enjoying star wars and gi joe lore. Star wars is an easy sell because the franchise is marketed properly. GI Joe as usual is the red headed step child. I am trying to convince myself that the retaliation line will be ok. I actually was ok with the ROC line but as pics have surfaced of the new figs I am concerned. My local Walmart finally got Renegades figs for the first time two weeks ago. I basically bought them out. I made a point of locating the guy in the store in charge of ordering toys to thank him (my 10 month old in arms and knowing the guy really has no control over it). But it made me feel better. I really enjoyed what they did with the retaliation line. A clever way of merging anniversary figs with an new angle. I was thrown off at first but enjoyed the developing story line. Renegades Duke with 8 of the same pistol blasters(exageration) was overkill but what the hell.

In regards to the retaliaion line I realistically see about 4 figures I personally want. I have never been a "I need them all collector" but I usually would get half to 3/4 of the figs. With the crappy packaging and lack of articulation in many of the figs I am at best pessimistically/optimistic. Hasbro please prove me wrong. I have even bought several of your star wars Pods for my kid for future play just because they are some how cool. But your joe figures lack luster. Hasbro please find the balance you seem to have found with the star wars lines witch addresses the kid in all of us and the collectors alike. What I have seen so far of the Retaliation line has done neither.

St. Nick

[composhop]

The canceled stands suck so much,i want Colton,Blind Master and Roadblock in front of my display,but all front figures have the 25th/PoC/30th stands(with name on it),don't want to start using clear protech stands again.
Same problem with Red Ninja and Black Dragon Ninja,i need 2-3 of each to display them with Renegades SS,how much does it cost to include a stand to every figure??? 5-10 cents?

[tycondrius]

that Zartan rocks I like the light piping on the heads to give him glowing eyes that gonna look sweet . its a pity the had to put the slit at the front of the cowl as aposed to the back

[DR.Sin]

I think the Zartan figure. He looks good to me. The colors look better than when we saw him in the first pics of this line. The blue weaponry is a bit off like most of the other figures', but there is more included with the figure, outside of the stand not being included. I like the sculpt of the figure, but the reduced articulation on this figure is going to be the major buzzkill for me.

As usual though, the packaging is really lacking in any real character appreciation to the entire Joe line. The no character art and no file card makes this a no, no. Hasbro, your completely ignoring the fans that bought and paid for your product for years. To get rid of that is a smack in the face.

[Alex Wuya]

So far, I feel no urge to buy that figure.

I hope there are some figures in this line that catch my attention, or at least come with some accessories I could use.

[composhop]

Don't know what thread it was but a few days ago some tanker wrote,Hasbro say "G.I.Joe is for kids and not collectors.I'm fine with that,i enjoy the figures i have(WITH stands,articulation and some nice accesoires...don't need rocket launchers,missile firing staffs,orange guns(didn't like them as a kid in early 90's,don't like them now) .if i'm honest,even my cheap toilet paper has a more interesting cardart then the retalation line ...so maybe i only buy Colton,Jinx and the 3-Pack Roadblock (face camo) loose on ebay and 2 of each(Red and Black Dragon Ninja's) and pass on the rest,normally i would buy cases,but for now,i'm 99% done with new stuff, less articulation,no stands,ugly cards,no filecards,higher prices(up to 11$???),missile launchers and orange guns,no love for collectors, Hasbro= the real G.i.Joe scalpers=no support

[blackman2005]

I can see myself buying this figure out of the Retaliation line. However, since these are aimed more towards parents to buy for their kids, the only thing that will shoot this line in the foot is the price point. If these figures don't go back down $6.97 each, they will not sell. The prices now just cannot be justified by the rising gas costs alone.

[Fred Broca XIII]

i think, there in lies my dilemma: i REALLY want to get my hands on 3 of those bruce willis figs for customs alone....but he will most undoubtedly be shortpacked AND in one of the later waves AND also sought after by other customizers. it's gonna be "shadow tracker" all over again for me.

It annoys me how they do that (ie: Renegades Storm Shadow)...I had to buy my Shadow Tracker on ebay...it's looking like I'm going to have to pick up most of the last three waves on ebay as well since my local stores decided they didn't want to stock action figures for the last 5 to 6 months...

[composhop]

Don't want to bitch around,i love the PoC and 30th line,Renegades Storm Shadow,but after we got this amazing stuff the last year(Low Light,Life Line,Sci Fi,Ultimate Snake Eyes,Shadow Tracker and Shock Trooper f.e....this new line is Hasbros Roundhouse kick in my face...and i'm sure a lot of you feel the same way.

[alkrawiec]

POC was the best series of Gi Joes that Hasbro created......More POC please..................

[eddy-arashikage]

These toys are design to bring in extra kids to the brand in line with the movie. The packaging has most of the primary colours in! Us adult collectors get a financial break for a while, there should be some great custom fodder for the customizers too. So its all good, im sure after the hype of the movie has died down they will go back to giving the collectors a few bonuses, after 25th/modern we had crappy roc but look what followed that! Chill guys lol

I personally can not wait to get a few of the parachute troopers to take down the woods with the kids! and I know they will love getting some of the vehicles they have seen in the movie, and my kids love the ninjas too!

[c_money_collins]

I dig that Zartan. Three extra heads is cool too for customizing. The package art is starting to be disappointing to me. I didn't really care at first, but I never really how much I dug the package art until it was gone.

It sounds like the short packed figs are gonna be extremely hard to get. Colton and Blind Master are obvious favs and we know there just won't be that many. God Bless you internet pre-order.

[IIIzoeIII]

I still think some cool customs will come from this guy

[Crimson Rage]

I don't know whether it's just that I'm in a bad mood today (too much sun), but these images of the RET packaging seem to be getting worse.

ZARTAN is a stinker: The composition of the card, the positioning of the figure, his accessories clumsily spread out, the absurd photo explaining what the three heads are for.. even the front piece with the name & copyright... Just about everything seems to have gone wrong with the presentation. Which is a shame, as this figure is one of the few I quite like.

[Odinsdad]

I just saved $10

[RANGER SMITTY]

That is the dumbest looking figure that I have ever seen. The entire Retaliation toy line looks like crap.

[minstrelboy]

I suppose it will be nice to take a break from collecting. I mean, I don't really have the money for it. I'm just afraid that if the movie line does terrible (which it seems destined for) that we might not see any more great lines like POC. There are a few figures I'll pick up from the movie line, but only once they're on clearance.

[Gyre-Viper]

Hasbro isn't screwing the collector over. It's simply our time to sit one out in regards to the hyper-detailed etc figures. Let the film do it's thing and when we see what Hasbro follows up with we'll have a better idea as to how to react. The success OR failure of the Retaliation film or line could work sooo many different ways in regards to the future of the brand... thus of course the future of catering to collectors on any level.

Let me be reiterate my feelings on the articulation issue... fuck that shit.
That's ridiculous. But everything else I'm okay with. Let Hasbro do their thing. We'll/they'll know soon enough if it pays off for them or not.

My biggest issue with this Zartan is that he's not in the press photo colours. The final colours are WAAAAY TOO Rise of Cobra. And that's silly. Whoever thought it was a good idea to put Zartan in Neo-Viper-y colours obviously wasn't paying attention to the complaints from ROC. Why even bother giving him the
coloured cowl if not the highlights from the press photos. Now he looks like a kit bash.

[rglass2]

You know what I love them all so far...yeah they are different, some even unusually, but new designs of old characters are always welcomed in my collection. Plus they have so much potential as is and as custom fodder.

[Justus Prime]

I have a theory on the card art, missing stand, and lack of articulation. Someone may have already brought this up. If so, sorry for the repeat. Due to rising prices of production Hasbro may have cut out all excess to drop the price again knowing very well the toyline won't sell to parents at ten bucks a pop. 5 cent stands times a couple million figures sold adds up. Then you have no artist/design fees for all the different card backs. Printing costs drop because of only printing 1 bulk cardback. I'm going out on a limb here but I bet the price point is going to be 5.99, 6.99 max. Just my random conjecture.

[snakeeyes566]

I have a theory on the card art, missing stand, and lack of articulation. Someone may have already brought this up. If so, sorry for the repeat. Due to rising prices of production Hasbro may have cut out all excess to drop the price again knowing very well the toyline won't sell to parents at ten bucks a pop. 5 cent stands times a couple million figures sold adds up. Then you have no artist/design fees for all the different card backs. Printing costs drop because of only printing 1 bulk cardback. I'm going out on a limb here but I bet the price point is going to be 5.99, 6.99 max. Just my random conjecture.

this

[Chris L]

Let me confirm the never, never, never, never, never EVER order from Kmart.

1. They typically use the closest store with "in stock" items to fill your order. So you are at the mercy of the "intelligence" of the K-mart employee for picking your items. The two times I ordered, they filled my order with related items but nothing even close to what I ordered. As an example, they will fill you order with ANY GI Joe figures when they don't have these really in stock.

2. Both times my incorrect items came in unsealed boxes without any packing material. By some crazy twist of fate, the incorrect items were all there in number. I was told to take the items back to the closest store. The manager there was very unhelpful and gave me attitude. Could you imagine if I had to explain items never made it in transit because the box was never sealed? I won't even go into the debate I had to go through with him because his price scanner was showing them half off even when the shelf sticker showed no sign of sale and the full price.

I can honestly say I would order from Toywiz before ever ordering from Kmart again.

[WarsawPactArms]

Justus Prime, I disagree on price point. Yesterday my local Target put the G.I. Joe pegs up to $10.99. They have 12 empty pegs when they only used to have 4. This must be for the movie figures. Why would they expand their shelf space and increase the price for any other reason?

[Krooklyn Dodger]

I read so many complaints about packaging. I look at the figure and wonder what the hell is Hasbro thinking with the Retaliation line. I mean, there had been vast improvements with the POC/ 30the line and now we get this stuff. Hardly anything from the Retaliation line resembles anything from the movie. F*** Hasbro.

[emags]

I tend to think prices are going up, and not down. I don't have kids, but I'd imagine action figures are some of the cheapest toys you can buy them. Even if they are $11 a pop, video games, i-pods, mobile phones, etc. (e.g. all of the stuff kids want today) are much more expensive.

If parents don't want to pay, $11, what are the other options? They all seem more expensive. Again, I don't have kids...so maybe there are other options....I just can't see kids getting too excited about lame-o dollar store figures (which some of these look like, btw) as a substitute toy.

[Dusty Ayers]

I think Zartan's design and weapons are pretty cool. However, it looks like he has no knee or ankle articulation which will really drop this figure in my opinion.

[Cdt Weasel]

I tend to think prices are going up, and not down. I don't have kids, but I'd imagine action figures are some of the cheapest toys you can buy them. Even if they are $11 a pop, video games, i-pods, mobile phones, etc. (e.g. all of the stuff kids want today) are much more expensive.

If parents don't want to pay, $11, what are the other options? They all seem more expensive. Again, I don't have kids...so maybe there are other options....I just can't see kids getting too excited about lame-o dollar store figures (which some of these look like, btw) as a substitute toy.

For $11 you can get 6 hotwheels cars and some track. My 2 year olds love that.

[Troops of Doom]

I can see myself buying this figure out of the Retaliation line. However, since these are aimed more towards parents to buy for their kids, the only thing that will shoot this line in the foot is the price point. If these figures don't go back down $6.97 each, they will not sell. The prices now just cannot be justified by the rising gas costs alone.

TNI reported the approximate retail price would be $7.99.
http://toynewsi.com/news.php?catid=311&itemid=18288

[Griff]

i am one of those rare few who could give a crap about packaging...i care about the figure and price...which reduced articulation and higher prices mean screw the line!

[Dake]

Blah blah, sky is falling.

Anyway, I wish they'd kept the earlier coloration - I think it was more interesting than just going mostly black and silver.

[Crimson Gord]

i don't care what they package these things in, but the stupid colored weapons are just terrible.

[Dusty Ayers]

I can see myself buying this figure out of the Retaliation line. However, since these are aimed more towards parents to buy for their kids, the only thing that will shoot this line in the foot is the price point. If these figures don't go back down $6.97 each, they will not sell. The prices now just cannot be justified by the rising gas costs alone.

The final price point on these figures will be very interesting. So far I think we can all agree that the Retaliation line has mixed opinions at best. However, if these figs are $11 as reported that would make a tough sell for a higher price for less articulation, stands, accessories etc.

[kennywr22]

I like the figure and agree the packaging is very movieish and not what we are used to. Although if these are priced around 6-7 dollars and the movie is popular than the kids will buy and so will the parents. If hasbro can get this line cranking and make money then us fans will benefit even more down the road.

[hahoo3]

still sucks! lol

Do we really need to Front Page every single figure/vehicle from the new toy line? The packaging is god awful.

[Black Llama]

i don't care what they package these things in, but the stupid colored weapons are just terrible.


I agree. The figure itself looks okay, but the blue crossbow and gun.... ugh. It's like someone heard how much I dislike off colored weapons and made these to spite me.....

[red4]

Do we really need to Front Page every single figure/vehicle

obviously

http://farm1.staticflickr.com/140/380590037_5e3ecc51fd.jpg

[Fred Broca XIII]

...they can cut costs on packaging all they want as far as I'm concerned, I open most of what I pick up anyway for display...

If they wanted to cut costs they should have stocked up on black plastic in bulk instead of all the neon colors they are using for their weapons now...hated that shit in the 90's when I was a kid, hate it as an adult...also if they want to cut costs, stop making those stupid oversized missile launchers, I would much rather get more accessories than one big dumb launcher that, after tormenting my cat with it, will spend it's days in a plastic bin after I open up the figure (my cat will also thank hasbro for this too)...

...did I hear correctly, that these figures won't be coming with stands...? ...if so that is the dumbest thing I've heard so far, how the hell do they expect those figures to hold the ridiculously oversized missile launchers without any support? ...they barely stand up on their own with a stand sometimes as it is...

[KINGOFNOD5]

Zartan looks great I really can't wait to get my hands on him.

[jmlawn]

WTF? I check hasbrotoyshop every damn day, when the f@$% did they list single card cobra vipers & officers & how the hell did they sell out already WTF HASBRO!

MAN WHY DOES COLLECTING GIJOE SUCK??????

[spiderpumpkin]

Kids want colorful packaging, accessories, rocket launchers and missiles. They don't care about the figure.

[SNAKE_EYES1975]

Hasbro isn't screwing the collector over. It's simply our time to sit one out in regards to the hyper-detailed etc figures. Let the film do it's thing and when we see what Hasbro follows up with we'll have a better idea as to how to react. The success OR failure of the Retaliation film or line could work sooo many different ways in regards to the future of the brand... thus of course the future of catering to collectors on any level.

Let me be reiterate my feelings on the articulation issue... fuck that shit.
That's ridiculous. But everything else I'm okay with. Let Hasbro do their thing. We'll/they'll know soon enough if it pays off for them or not.

My biggest issue with this Zartan is that he's not in the press photo colours. The final colours are WAAAAY TOO Rise of Cobra. And that's silly. Whoever thought it was a good idea to put Zartan in Neo-Viper-y colours obviously wasn't paying attention to the complaints from ROC. Why even bother giving him the
coloured cowl if not the highlights from the press photos. Now he looks like a kit bash.

Calm rational posts like these have NO place here...

kidding aside..Im with you. I may look for a colton figure, and thats really it. Im not "PISSED"..Not "NERDRAGING"...Ive simply shrugged my shoulders and said "Fuck all this shit until the movie comes out"

My hunches have been pretty good on this through the years. Even if these were 5.99 a pop...This shit is going to have initial success, just like ROC, from the movie hype...And then fall on its face 2 weeks after. Everyone will be happy when Target clearances them again for 88 Cents.

OR, I could be the same thing they did for the DOTM Transformers line...Issue out CRAZY good coupons so the stores dont have much to clearance. This shit looks SO DAMN LOW BUDGET, It should have a problem with an identity crisis sitting next to the Corps! figures in stores..

I have ZERO interest in the COCKTEASE mentality of creating molds with superior articulation and play value, only to take steps back.

I have not seen a DAMN thing from this line...That I look at and say "I gotta have that"...Not a DAMN thing.

[JoeMama]

oh sweet! this is perfect for when I want Zartan to impersonate random red stripe on head guy!
YES! thank you hasbro!

[CVdelgado]

the bright side is im saving money... keep telling myself that...

[Gyre-Viper]

Calm rational posts like these have NO place here...

kidding aside..Im with you. I may look for a colton figure, and thats really it. Im not "PISSED"..Not "NERDRAGING"...Ive simply shrugged my shoulders and said "Fuck all this shit until the movie comes out"

My hunches have been pretty good on this through the years. Even if these were 5.99 a pop...This shit is going to have initial success, just like ROC, from the movie hype...And then fall on its face 2 weeks after. Everyone will be happy when Target clearances them again for 88 Cents.

OR, I could be the same thing they did for the DOTM Transformers line...Issue out CRAZY good coupons so the stores dont have much to clearance. This shit looks SO DAMN LOW BUDGET, It should have a problem with an identity crisis sitting next to the Corps! figures in stores..

I have ZERO interest in the COCKTEASE mentality of creating molds with superior articulation and play value, only to take steps back.

I have not seen a DAMN thing from this line...That I look at and say "I gotta have that"...Not a DAMN thing.



The articulation thing pisses me off so so much. Those aren't Joes to me.
They'll be filed away as GI JOE history but they're just not Joes.

I've spent the last year talking to half a dozen or so former Hasbro employees. Listening to their stories/anecdotes about changes in the Joe line. Extreme. Savage. Super Joe. Etc. Experimentation with articulation etc. Why things had to be done. Why things were thought to be good reasons to do said things. But this is 2012. I could care less about movie card art. I could care less about stands, give or take.
File cards for a film line? Eh. As long as there are file cards (even shitty ones) for the non-film lines I'm okay. But articulation is sacred for GI JOE. S-A-C-R-E-D.

That being said the Joe Trooper is pretty damn cool. I think people will find that one to be the big one to have. I'm curious to see what the Cobra Trooper is like.

[hotmitts]

...I've spent the last year talking to half a dozen or so former Hasbro employees. Listening to their stories/anecdotes about changes in the Joe line....Why things had to be done....

Sounds interesting! Can we read about that anywhere?

The big question for me is;
Once they do whatever they do with the Movie line, which must be seen as a separate line almost, what then? This doesn't have to be the new standard in articulation, it may be a temporary Movie-line thing, then back to business as usual. As I'm sure MU will continue as it's always been during/after the Avengers Movie.

People would rather believe that it's an Apocalyptic bombshell?

[spiderpumpkin]

Sounds interesting! Can we read about that anywhere?

The big question for me is;
Once they do whatever they do with the Movie line, which must be seen as a separate line almost, what then? This doesn't have to be the new standard in articulation, it may be a temporary Movie-line thing, then back to business as usual. As I'm sure MU will continue as it's always been during/after the Avengers Movie.

People would rather believe that it's an Apocalyptic bombshell?

Podcast probably in the works.

[wormser]

why does everyone keep saying the zartan is renegades? he just looks like....well....zartan. looks like another version. he might look like this in the film too.

[Gyre-Viper]

Sounds interesting! Can we read about that anywhere?

The big question for me is;
Once they do whatever they do with the Movie line, which must be seen as a separate line almost, what then? This doesn't have to be the new standard in articulation, it may be a temporary Movie-line thing, then back to business as usual. As I'm sure MU will continue as it's always been during/after the Avengers Movie.

People would rather believe that it's an Apocalyptic bombshell?


There will be things to read, listen to, and see. Just a matter of putting it out there in a manner that makes sense etc.

As for your big question... that really is the big question: What happens after the film?! A new era of GI JOE? A hybrid line of at-kids/at-collectors? I think it really depends on if the film and/or film toys do well and what someone at Hasbro has to say about that. And if Paramount decides they want even more of a say so etc.



why does everyone keep saying the zartan is renegades? he just looks like....well....zartan. looks like another version. he might look like this in the film too.


I am 99.9% sure he is NOT Renegades Zartan. He has the same harness/cowl thing. But everyone is saying he's some sort of canceled Renegades figure and I don't see it. Not at all.

[MeLikeJinx]

hasbro isn't screwing the collector over. It's simply our time to sit one out in regards to the hyper-detailed etc figures. Let the film do it's thing and when we see what hasbro follows up with we'll have a better idea as to how to react. The success or failure of the retaliation film or line could work sooo many different ways in regards to the future of the brand... Thus of course the future of catering to collectors on any level.
R to the O to the C. Been there. Done that. Next.

[Gyre-Viper]

R to the O to the C. Been there. Done that. Next.


Eh... not really. ROC paved the way with detail and sculpt and articulation for POC and so forth. Don't get me wrong 200% of ROC was absolutely worthless to me toy-wise. With the exception of TRU Firefly, Volcano Viper, and MAYBE an ounce of Helix... I try to avoid all ROC-ness unless it's some canceled concept that was a million times better than what we got.

Retaliation is all subtraction. At least ROC stepped up a few things... even if certain aesthetics and choices were left lacking. I'd take lacking over subtraction any day.

[rocker82]

The packaging for Zartan looks lame, but I'll still buy it no matter what!

[Beckley]

Looks like it'll just be a few Red Ninjas for me and maybe the Shockwave HISS.

Edit: Oh, and the Night Viper & CG's if they ever make it to retail.

[Daver]

I like the overall design of the RETALIATION toyline,but the packaging is very poorly designed,looks like it's rushed too much.
Luckely I don't collect on card because of transport costs ( I live in Europe )
But for all you Americans out here,you're f***ed ! ;-p

[The Rob Identity]

The red at the top of the Zartan heads makes it look like he got scalped. If that hideous thing winds up in my collection, he's getting posed with Recondo & tomahawk. That is all.

[Dusty Ayers]

I like the figure and agree the packaging is very movieish and not what we are used to. Although if these are priced around 6-7 dollars and the movie is popular than the kids will buy and so will the parents. If hasbro can get this line cranking and make money then us fans will benefit even more down the road.

I sincerely hope you're right. The only problem I have with this plan is what a successful limited POA line will say to Hasbro. It seems fairly obvious that if this line is a runaway success then Hasbro will assume that releasing more figs with limited POA and few accessories is the way to move forward because it will definitely be cheaper for them.

[Dusty Ayers]

The articulation thing pisses me off so so much. Those aren't Joes to me.
They'll be filed away as GI JOE history but they're just not Joes.

I've spent the last year talking to half a dozen or so former Hasbro employees. Listening to their stories/anecdotes about changes in the Joe line. Extreme. Savage. Super Joe. Etc. Experimentation with articulation etc. Why things had to be done. Why things were thought to be good reasons to do said things. But this is 2012. I could care less about movie card art. I could care less about stands, give or take.
File cards for a film line? Eh. As long as there are file cards (even shitty ones) for the non-film lines I'm okay. But articulation is sacred for GI JOE. S-A-C-R-E-D.

That being said the Joe Trooper is pretty damn cool. I think people will find that one to be the big one to have. I'm curious to see what the Cobra Trooper is like.

I couldn't agree with you more. I like to put my guys in crazy action poses so stands aren't a big deal to me. Although I dislike the packaging that isn't a deal breaker either. If Hasbro had to save some money then I can live with those choices they made. The one choice that I can't stomach is reducing the articulation on single card figs. Hands down Gi Joe is the best articulated line on the market today and a reduction in POA just sucks. I think the thing that makes it even more bitter is that some of these sculpts like CC and Zartan are fantastic.

[Crystal Ball]

My crystal ball predicts the death of the line.

[Crimson Rage]

Hmm, I just realised: As I expect I'll be buying what RET Joes I want (not many, I admit) from Dorkside Toys, I'll be getting them loose anyway. I won't even get the packaging to be 'disgusted' by.

[Troynos]

The more I look at the Retaliation line, the less I'm interested in.

Out of the first wave, only interesed in Zartan and possibly the Joe trooper.

The rest that is upcoming: Firefly, Colton, Rock (without battle kata), Blind Master, Jinx, Lady Jaye, Night Viper, CG. Interested in 3 out of 4 3-packs (the SE/SS/"Slice" one is a pass). Want the Ninja Combat Cruiser (the vamp) and thats about it for vehicles.

I doubt I'll be army-building anything.

Hopefully the follow-up to Retaliation is interesting.

[davy580]

are the red areas on zartan's hood and extra heads the same deal they use to make figs eyes light up? thats what it looks like to me.

damn- that hood was the only thing i wanted.. in this entire line...

[Troynos]

are the red areas on zartan's hood and extra heads the same deal they use to make figs eyes light up? thats what it looks like to me.

damn- that hood was the only thing i wanted.. in this entire line...

Yes. It's to make the eyes light up.

[Ash Talon]

The only articulation Zartan seems to be missing are ankles (based on other pics). He might only have single knees, but I can't tell at this point. So fears about a great loss of articulation, at least in regards to Zartan, might be a bit unfounded.

I didn't realize that the Retaliation line was lacking stands. I think that sucks a bit. Hasbro has cut out stands for the Marvel lines as well. At least there are several online companies making stands, though, so there are options to replace them.

Overall, I'll reiterate my feelings on the Retaliation line not being too bad. Most of the figures look good. While a few figures are lacking some articulation, there are other versions of those characters with more articulation. My biggest concern are the crappy vehicle drivers. They're no longer an incentive as far as I'm concerned.

Looking at the GI Joe brand and action figure market in general, I'm a little concerned with Hasbro's approach to the Joe brand (as well as other brands like the Marvel lines). Action figures don't make up as large a portion of the toy industry as they once did. In fact, they're behind things like plush which wasn't the case in the past. So the number of kids supporting action figures have declined. On the other hand, there are probably more adult collectors than ever before. So action figures are finding a new balance between kids and adults.

That said, I find it odd that Hasbro is cutting back on so many things that are hallmarks of adult collectors, namely articulation and stands. I can understand them doing it on movie lines, since most movie line purchasers will likely be transitory and not stick with a brand long-term. Unless you really wow them, that is. I think Hasbro needs to look a little more long-term. They need to really impress people with their product and create lasting identities for their brands.

GI Joe has always been about high-articulation. From the brand's inception. Cutting back on articulation seems to go against the brand's identity and certainly isn't going impress people familiar with the brand. I understand there are kickbacks going to the studios for their movie lines, so Hasbro wants to reduce their costs in the lines. Maybe we just have to weather the dip in articulation for the movie stuff, and post-movie stuff will be back up to POC/35th standard? If so, I can deal with it. I think it creates a bit of an identity crisis with the line, but there are plenty of items from the Retaliation line which I'll buy and can fit in with my other Joe stuff.

[DESTRO]

Retaliation is all subtraction. At least ROC stepped up a few things... even if certain aesthetics and choices were left lacking. I'd take lacking over subtraction any day.

Hard to argue with that. I'm really not happy about losing the stands the most. However there are a few figures that I think are great, and I will be buying them.

[Troynos]

Yeah. Never order online from KMart. They had the canceled RoC alphas (that made it to Ross and Canada) on their site. Ordered it and got a normal mole pod, Snow Job with Rockslide and Scrap Iron with Snaketrax.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Let me confirm the never, never, never, never, never EVER order from Kmart.

1. They typically use the closest store with "in stock" items to fill your order. So you are at the mercy of the "intelligence" of the K-mart employee for picking your items. The two times I ordered, they filled my order with related items but nothing even close to what I ordered. As an example, they will fill you order with ANY GI Joe figures when they don't have these really in stock.

2. Both times my incorrect items came in unsealed boxes without any packing material. By some crazy twist of fate, the incorrect items were all there in number. I was told to take the items back to the closest store. The manager there was very unhelpful and gave me attitude. Could you imagine if I had to explain items never made it in transit because the box was never sealed? I won't even go into the debate I had to go through with him because his price scanner was showing them half off even when the shelf sticker showed no sign of sale and the full price.

I can honestly say I would order from Toywiz before ever ordering from Kmart again.

Reminds me of the time when peeps who ordered the Cancelled ROC wave 3 vehicles and ended up getting standard ROC mole pods lol...that was the bees knees of jellybean funniness

[RolandofGilead]

I made the mistake of ordering some Cars 2 exclusives from them on line. When I got to the store, it was the usual crap on everyone's shelves. It took me 10 minutes to explain to the manager that they weren't what I wanted, then I had to wait weeks for my credit card to get charged back.

[Gyre-Viper]

Hard to argue with that. I'm really not happy about losing the stands the most. However there are a few figures that I think are great, and I will be buying them.


Oh I agree... the Joe Trooper and Blind Master are AMAZING. Blind Master is seriously soooo incredible that I really hope he comes with absolutely everything we saw cuz I want him to be as amazing as he looks.

[CrimsonGuard101]

Oh I agree... the Joe Trooper and Blind Master are AMAZING. Blind Master is seriously soooo incredible that I really hope he comes with absolutely everything we saw cuz I want him to be as amazing as he looks.

The additional accessories we axed due to rising french fry prices. I expect accessories to be a minimum like the final Renegades figures expereinced...you gotta make room for thier over sized plastic rayden hats and superspastic giant sized missile launchers somehow...

[Derek2783]

The more I look at the Retaliation line, the less I'm interested in.

...I doubt I'll be army-building anything....

Hopefully the follow-up to Retaliation is interesting.


I feel pretty much the same way. I might buy Snake-Eyes, just because I'm a sucker for Snake-Eyes. I want 3 of the black ninjas, and after that... I'm done.

[orezona]

SO glad I'm an opener and not MOC kind of collector.

Anybody know who did all the art for the PoC/30th cards? Whoever it was is seriously talented.

[CrimsonGuard101]

SO glad I'm an opener and not MOC kind of collector.

Anybody know who did all the art for the PoC/30th cards? Whoever it was is seriously talented.

Somone that wasnt important enough to keep around thats for sure. I guess when you look at what The Rock's likness license probaley cost...I bet half of the design team was axed to compensate the load...

[Steevy Maximus]

The only articulation Zartan seems to be missing are ankles (based on other pics). He might only have single knees, but I can't tell at this point. So fears about a great loss of articulation, at least in regards to Zartan, might be a bit unfounded.

I agree that much of the fuss over "loss of articulation" is still vastly overblown, in regards to the single figures. The general trend I'm seeing is loss of ankles and double knees, in some cases the extra range in the wrists. The figures are still playable, and I don't think much is being lost in cutting at those areas (especially when you consider the cuts the Marvel lines are seeing in their media based lines).

Hell, some of the figures with the MOST comprised articulation are the figures that will probably get 2 or 3 figures anyway (or are character/concepts fans don't give a shit about, like action feature Roadblock)

That said, I find it odd that Hasbro is cutting back on so many things that are hallmarks of adult collectors, namely articulation and stands. I can understand them doing it on movie lines, since most movie line purchasers will likely be transitory and not stick with a brand long-term. Unless you really wow them, that is. I think Hasbro needs to look a little more long-term. They need to really impress people with their product and create lasting identities for their brands.
But Retaliation IS a movie line :p And from what I'm seeing, it is being handled like any other movie line (like the Marvel lines, including similar packaging style). So the likely assumption is that sales WILL drop next year when those transitory consumers have moved on, so I question the NEED to do all those "collector flourishes" when most collectors seem to deride the film as a concept, and would ultimately be moot if kids and their parents don't get interested in the brand at all.

Ultimately, I think Hasbro is looking long term: and that's the GI Joe brand CANNOT be solely supported by collectors (the last year has been the weakest Joe support year I've ever seen, even fucking SIGMA SIX had better retail support than the brand has seen since the end of RoC). If Retaliation can bring in kids to support the GI Joe brand (which they clearly aren't in any appreciable number at the moment), then, like Transformers, collectors will ultimately benefit from the increased retail support.

An issue I want to stress is that GI Joe has seen some of the best toys EVER in the last two years....but some of the weakest retail support since 2000. Clearly, whatever they're doing (high articulation, tons of accessories, stands, etc) isn't bringing in a whole lot of consumers.
It doesn't matter how amazing your product is if the retailers aren't going to buy the damn things.

GI Joe has always been about high-articulation. From the brand's inception. Cutting back on articulation seems to go against the brand's identity and certainly isn't going impress people familiar with the brand.
I question how familiar a lot of people are with the brand to begin with looking at the mediocre retail support. People familiar with the brand are either buying or aren't already, a movie and its accompanying media blitz I don't feel is going to change that. The issue will be if the movie will get kids who are NOT already into JOe into the brand (and in that case, most won't have any pre-existing bias anyway, or will be basing it on what they've gotten in similar lines like Captain America)

Again, I don't feel the articulation loss is that extreme. Yes, there have been cuts, but most are still more articulated than a good portion of the market. We don't need every Joe capable of yoga to be good toys. I'm largely of the view the CHARACTERS are the focus (which ties into Ash Talon's remark about a strong BRAND IDENTITY), not necessarily the toys.

I got Batman toys with 5 POAs as a kid, and I didn't like them any less than my RAH Joes.

[spiderpumpkin]

I think these will be on many kid's christmas lists this year.

[Crazy Legs]

You know what's sad?
That Cobra Commander has more weapons than Duke when CC is one of those figs that usually comes with one gun and a bunch of random crap.

[Odinsdad]

I think these will be in Odin's mom's clearance hauls hauls year.

[CrimsonGuard101]

You know what's sad?
That Cobra Commander has more weapons than Duke when CC is one of those figs that usually comes with one gun and a bunch of random crap.

And that Cobra staff isnt random enough crap for ya?

[spiderpumpkin]

Wow, that Duke launcher is even cooler looking with that zipper trigger.

[B and H Comics]

Yeah, I've heard stories about that.


Never ever ever ever ever ever order from Kmart.com, folks.


except that I got a BMF Millinium Falcon for 42 dollarsshipped from K mart.com

[Raw Dog]

That Rock looks wicked pissah dude! I cannot frigg'n wait bro. These new Retaliation figures are going to be the bees knees.

[Super Beast]

IS that Roadblock missing a chest joint?

[BIGJIM]

K-Mart has a terrible terrible terrible problem with having items listed that it never actually carries.

This true.
I ordered a SW Arc Troopers BP one day that was "in stock" at my local store. I got a phone call an hour after I ordered at and the toy manager asked me if I wanted a Rep. troopers BP or some other crappy CW BP.
They suck.

[WeaponXIII]

The light up eyes gimmick has ruined all the alternate heads this lack of articulation, blue gunned, standee-less figure came with...ruining the last reason why I may have picked him up...oh well, that's another one I won't be getting...damn Hasbro, that makes it 0 out of 4 so far for me...a first since before the 25th line first came out.

[Hit n Run]

Awesome!! Dont have to pay for a benchpress to make a Sgt,Slaughter now.

[ultramax]

FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL and a great sgt slughter body, hope the skin color matches

[Laser Viper]

Only CC and SE look good. hopefully this line gets better soon.

[sbartek1974]

Does Duke come with a helmet? Would be nice if he did. I'd troop build him as a modern Greenshirt.

[ultramax]

skipping the whole line until wave 5 ( night viper biatcchhhhh )

[the odinson]

god, those things look bad on the card. like 'this has to be a joke' bad. i sure hope kids buy these things.

[Kthakkar]

Hope these sell so maybe they beef up the accessories again. I'm thinking that CC will be an easy '91 version custom.

[fireflyguy]

In the words of Rain Man:

"Kmart sucks".

[Python_Puckman]

The Rock's head is sitting too high on those neck and traps muscles.

This is the one that comes with that gigantic "battle-kata" rocket launcher and has some sort of shoulder piece for him to balance that huge thing on. It was probably the only way to get him to hold that thing was to stretch out his neck... easy pass on this one. Cobra Commander will be the only one I get from this first wave. And Stormy if he's part of wave 1 too. I'm not really keeping track of this crap.

[CoolKirk77]

That Roadblock figure doesn't look like the Rock at all. Look more like Mr. Clean with a goatee. Or Yul Brynner. :D

[joedelta]

looks like i will only be picking up the good guys and firefly

[emags]

Wow, these figures are terrible. No card art, file cards, stands and reduced, in some instances, articulation. Ugh. Plus, I had been looking forward to picking up a The Rock figure, but this head sculpt is not good at all. I agree with the poster who compared him to Yuel Brenner. It's not The Rock though.

[Loose Cannon]

That Rock looks like he would make a decent GUNG-HO. Too bad about the damn hand key. Come on hasbro that SUCKS! Put an extra hand in there. The amount of money wasted on stupid gimmicky srping loaded weapons could have paid for the damn ankle rocker articulation. An extra hand. I think I will mail this crap back in protest with a fake return address so they have to keep it.

At least CC looks half decent. DUKE LOOKS LIKE DOOKEY! I agree, a helmet would go a long way to making him at least a green shirt. But I use all my ROC Dukes as green shirts. I guess my Joe's have clones too.

[returnofplex]

That Rock looks like sure fire Slaughter-fodder to me. Better start casting some more heads.......

[B and H Comics]

I thought Hasbro said the Key hand was not happening.

I think Hasbro sabatuoged the club to focus our wrath elsewhere, lol.

[Adamantite]

I thought Hasbro said the Key hand was not happening.



Hasbro said the hand thing is not happening on the Roadblock in the 3-pack, it is on this one though.