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What secrets lurk in the filecards?
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04-13-2015, 10:02 PM
oliverbox
I Ride with Claymore!!!
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Alexandria, Virginia
Posts: 6,821
Quote:
Originally Posted by
plague
Why does hasbro not utilize Hama while they can? The arah comic and toys need to join forces.
Let me begin by saying that I've been reading Mr. Hama's Joeverse since I was a very young child. I have collected all the bound editions, and I continue to subscribe/read the new comic EVERY month. So, over the years, I've spent a lot of money on Mr. Hama's Joeverse, and overall I think it's great. It's an integral part of my childhood.
That being said, I think all that time, effort, and money has earned me the right to an opinion, and a rather informed/well-earned opinion.
Here's the truth as I see it: Larry Hama isn't a god. He's had real moments of brilliance, and he's had LONG runs of excellent story telling. But there have also been some dark marks on his record, and there were monthes at a time when he was really just phoneing it in, or was on a weird (ninja) tanget.
Now, the argument could certainly be made that in the initial 155 issues, that he was too constrained/obligated to include Hasbro's new products... to push new characters, to push new vehicles - all to sell more toys. And it's easy to see how that might stiffle the creative process and interfere with a continuity of storytelling. But it was never an insurmountable challenge, and sometimes it seems like he was honestly mad at Hasbro.
He admits that he's never planned out any longterm storylines. Well, that's probably a mistake. If he had taken a little time to think through the sub-team storylines, they could have been really cool. How he handled Tiger Force, Eco-Warriors, the D.E.F.... it was terrible, and it didn't have to be. With a little planning and effort, those could have been some really cool storylines.
And now let's talk about the elephant in the room of Larry's shortcoming as a storyteller: Ninjas. I mean, serisously, what the heck? It's WAY too much ninja crap, and the ninjas are WAY too out of proportion when it comes to abilities. There are issues when it doesn't even make sense for there to be a G.I. Joe team... just send in Snake-Eyes. And after Storm Shadow joined the Joes, what was the point? The end of the 155-issue run was, for the most part, abysmal. And Larry doesn't really deny this issue with the ninjas. He's said in interviews that he basically sees the whole story as The Story of Snake-Eyes. At times it felt like American Ninja.
There are great characters that were never developed, because he never even bothered to develop a legitimate chain-of-command for the Joe Team. He complains that he hated Duke because Hasbro forced him to use Duke, and Hama preferred Stalker. If he had simply planned and used a chain-of-command, there was pleny of room for both... and for Flint, and for Falcon, and even for Grid-Iron, Claymore, and all the other "leader" characters.
In a big way, this thread has been about sorting out the mess Mr. Hama left of the continuity. I'm not saying that it all fits together neatly, but we've made a real effort an we've done a pretty good job.
Which brings me to Hasbro... I firmly believe that there are at least 3 main Joe continuities: The Hamaverse of the Comics, the Cartoon from the 80's, and the actual toy line from Hasbro. Obviously there is a lot of overlap, but studied independently there are some very big differences. The most apparent differences are between the cartoon and the comicbook. However, the toyline tried to blend elements of both, while asserting it's own continuity.
Example: G.I. Joe Leadership
Hasbro intended Hawk to be the leader. But then they start adding characters with different ranks, as if they are intentionally trying to fill the ranks of a chain-of-command. Duke doesn't replace Hawk; he works for him. Duke is the First Sgt. That's not a replacement for Stalker, either. Stalker was an E-5, like a fire team leader.
Then Flint shows up. He's not a replacement for Duke. He's a Warrant Officer. His job is completely different. He's similar to Duke is some ways - and the cartoon used them erroneously as interchangable - but why wouldn't Hasbro just give them the same rank if they were the same?
Falcon comes along, again similar qualifications to Duke and Flint, but he's a young officer - like a Platoon Leader or a SF Team XO, at that time. Claymore and Grid-Iron are also similarly qualified, but different with different specialties.
If we look at the ranks closely, Hasbro's own continuity and chain-of-command makes the most sense of the three. It's not perfect - they were just selling toys to children, after all - but it's well planned out and makes a lot of sense.
__________________
Why aren't there more Joes from the Deep South?
And would it kill Hasbro to give us a Marine Corps Officer?
Last edited by oliverbox; 04-13-2015 at
11:08 PM
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